At 11:26 PM 2/28/2009, Keytium wrote:

>i was planing on having different types of source, on the outer
>planes sources would be granted by gods or be powered by the planes
>nature (you could drain pure chaos from limbo ectra) the problem
>with being granted by the gods is where to draw the line between
>this and a church holding?

Personally, my take on this kind of thing is that the gods themselves
take the power of worship, leadership, divinity, etc. that is all
wrapped up into the concept we call "regency" in BR and gather it up
directly. There are no regents in the outer planes because there is
no need of them, and why would the gods create such beings when they
could just take that power from its source without the need of a
"middle man." In this context, it`s worth noting that even the
presence of intermediaries in BR is rather carefully described as an
accident or byproduct of the setting`s background. None of the gods
intended to create scions; it just happened as a result of their
struggle with Azrai at Deismaar.

So, the question "where should I (as DM) draw the line?" is probably
best answered first by asking "why would to gods draw such a line in
the first place?" In BR, the "why?" is explained by the struggle
between the gods. In Planescape or SJ one needs an explanation for
the "why?" first, and once one gets that then "where?" should fall
into place more easily. One could also start to see "who might gain
such powers?" and "what are those powers?"

One could, for instance, interpret a particular mythology as having a
group of divine intermediaries (like, say, angels) who interact with
divinely favored mortals (saints) who are granted particular powers
based upon their self-sacrifice or abject faith. Such saints might
become the focus of worship themselves as intermediaries between
mortals and the divine, and that worship might take the form of some
sort of regency-like system. Maybe they can use the energy to cast
the equivalent of realm spells that look like miracles to the
faithful. I wouldn`t suggest that one in particular, but it works as
an example. Something more apt to the setting in particular would be better.

In PS, for example, there are the existing organizations in the form
of the factions, and their various incarnations. That seems like the
best starting point for some sort of political level of play for that
setting. The wards of Sigil seem like the most likely size of "provinces."

>to be honest i wouldn`t be able to write a whole new lists of realm
>spells so what would you reconmend?

I`d suggest you use the BR realm spells as a starter, and come up
with realm spells that do similar things but in a much more general
and simple way. That is, instead of a Bless Army spell that adds to
the stats of a particular set of units it should just grant a bonus
to everyone of that faction. Curse the same way. Since the amount
of effort is an issue, they should be expressed as simply as
possible. Cost, requirements and brief description of effects. Example:

BLESS FACTION
Cost: 5 pts. (or what you think is appropriate.)
Requirement: Small faction (a level maybe if that`s how you`re doing it.)
Benefit: All members of the faction gain a +1 to their attack rolls
during their next conflict.

DEFEND FACTION
Cost: 10 pts. (ditto.)
Requirement: Medium faction
Benefit: Your faction headquarters becomes barricaded giving all
factions members a +1 to defend/AC from that position.

Etc.

The cost, requirements and effects of those "realm spells" will, of
course, depend on the features of the "faction level" that you decide
upon, but in general the BR realm spells would serve as a good outline.

Hope that helps.

Gary