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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Dagmar Druesbane

    Discussion thread for Dagmar Druesbane. If you would like to add a comment, click the Post Reply button.

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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Boy, she must have a nasty attitude and no social skills if she can look like yet have a Charisma of 9.

    From looking at the nice portraits that people are providing for the BR wiki (see http://www.birthright.net/brwiki/ind...egory:Portrait) , I am starting to believe that when all models die, they go to Cerilia.

    Sorontar

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    There's always Guthrim Gauksson.

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    Administrator Green Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorontar View Post
    Boy, she must have a nasty attitude and no social skills if she can look like yet have a Charisma of 9.

    From looking at the nice portraits that people are providing for the BR wiki (see http://www.birthright.net/brwiki/ind...egory:Portrait) , I am starting to believe that when all models die, they go to Cerilia.

    Sorontar
    Now, now. We all know that fantasy women are all pretty, well rounded and scantily clad. That is the real reason the genre is called "fantasy" - as in male-teen-fantasy

    I'm guilty myself...of making low-cha NPCs look attractive...excusing the fact with some lame notion of "cha isn't only appearance you know"
    Cheers
    Bjørn
    DM of Ruins of Empire II PbeM

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    Junior Member Capricia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Knight View Post
    Now, now. We all know that fantasy women are all pretty, well rounded and scantily clad. That is the real reason the genre is called "fantasy" - as in male-teen-fantasy
    And here I thought chain mail bikini's were just "adjusted for weight" for the fairer sex.

    And fyi, all my male BR characters are broad of shoulder, chiselled of jaw and have skill points in "toilet seat down."

    That's real fantasy. *grins*

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    Well I haven't made any with chainmail bikinis. Everything is period dress. The real distinction I notice is between characters who have PC classes and those with NPC classes. PC types, have cooler pics (and are generally more attractive) than NPC types. Someone the characters might encounter in an adventure vs someone's spouse who never leaves court. That kind of thing.

    As for Charisma, I don't think much of it is appearance. I see too many pretty people who can't organize, coordinate, or lead a small work group out of wet paper bag. Charisma is the ability to impose one's will on others using social skills.

    Dagmar Druesbane's low charisma means average (or -1) Charisma modifiers to rally checks, recruitment checks, diplomacy, leadership, attempts to push troops or get people to go places or do things they don't want to do, like work an extra shift reconstructing the south wall of the fort.

    I don't spend much game time trying get characters to seduce others, get dates, or doing the things that appearance are most useful for. Politics, politics, and some politics thrown in for good measure is what Charisma gets applied to for my sense of things. Plenty easy for pretty people to not handle that too well.

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    Delayed response, my apologies.

    The last paragraph seems confused: what is the lure that Dagmar created to combat the Witch's army?

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    Sending the giants in to inhabit the old fort in the first place. That's gonna draw adventurers for sure. The watch might have been content to leave the fort alone, but adventurers, acting alone without considering how their actions effect the world around them is a different matter. But, once the adventurers clear the fort, it will provide tempting to the Watch. This, however will stretch their forces too thin. Once they have foolishly garrisoned the old fort, attack Bjorlangen which is now too weak to defend itself. Once taken, the watch is divided. The White Witch has two options, and it rather depends on Dhoesone. If Dhoesone is going to aid the old fort, then leave them have it and wipe out the Watch and take their provinces (or loot them, sell them into slavery, and reduce the holdings to dust, eliminating a rival faction). If Dhoesone doesn't aid them, the White Witch will move in and siege the fort, take it and then turn on the Watch. If espionage won't reveal what Dhoesone will do, try and see. Defending the old fort from the White Witch is an adventure in Giantdowns, so even if the PC's are from elsewhere and bring aid from Dhoesone or someplace else, the White Witch will see how well its defended.

    The Watch is now poised for utter destruction. Can the PC's intervene and save the day?

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    In a message dated 6/18/2008 4:20:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
    brnetboard@BIRTHRIGHT.NET writes:

    kgauck wrote:
    Sending the giants in to inhabit the old fort in the first place. That`s
    gonna draw adventurers for sure. The watch might have been content to leave the
    fort alone, but adventurers, acting alone without considering how their
    actions effect the world around them is a different matter. But, once the
    adventurers clear the fort, it will provide tempting to the Watch. This, however will
    stretch their forces too thin. Once they have foolishly garrisoned the old
    fort, attack Bjorlangen which is now too weak to defend itself. Once taken,
    the watch is divided. The White Witch has two options, and it rather depends on
    Dhoesone. If Dhoesone is going to aid the old fort, then leave them have it
    and wipe out the Watch and take their provinces (or loot them, sell them into
    slavery, and reduce the holdings to dust, eliminating a rival faction). If
    Dhoesone doesn`t aid them, the White Witch will move in and siege the fort,
    take it and then turn on the Watch. If espionage won`t reveal what Dh
    oesone will do, try and see. Defending the old fort from the White Witch is
    an adventure in Giantdowns, so even if the PC`s are from elsewhere and bring
    aid from Dhoesone or someplace else, the White Witch will see how well its
    defended.



    The Watch is now poised for utter destruction. Can the PC`s intervene and
    save the day?


    That`s the Witch`s plan? I`d like to tidy that up, for clarity, sometime.

    No offense, but I rated this as one of those infuriating inconsistencies. I
    read the Witch as a mistress of the quiet and slow techniques of taking
    over. Popping an army up in the middle of a country doesn`t cut it for me,
    especially when it`s one so far away she can`t do anything with it. Using giants
    to draw out the Watch is good as far as it goes, but why? By using an army,
    she`s drawing attention to both herself and the area.

    Lee.
    Last edited by Thelandrin; 06-20-2008 at 12:22 AM.

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    In general I agree. But I didn't think that given the free-for-all in the Downs, it was worth just excising this different approach for the White Witch. Not only do we have the Bjorlangen invasion, we have Rowena Manspear, several adventure descriptions, we end up discarding a lot of material.

    What certainly makes the most sense is removing the White Witch behind a series of cut-outs. So that figuring out who is doing all this requires determining that some mysterious figure named Rowena Manspear is behind all of this business by the Kjarhoelle clan, and only much work will ever reveal (if more so than when) that Rowena is an agent of the White Witch.

    The descriptions of the Bjorlangen adventure hook "after the fall" is the only one written up so far, but this and subsequent descriptions could make all of this business look and sound like Kjarhoelle clan activity, with hints lurking about that Rowena Manspear might be orchestrating Kjarhoelle clan operations, then on Rowena's page, the truth is revealed as a secret.

    The most glaring parts, the invasion of Bjorlangen, the adventure "After the Fall" and the Siege of the old fort of Lemnjohen adventure are out of the King of the Giantdowns book, and deal with the White Witch's army. The only thing I added was some inter-relationships between events to actually craft a master plan for the White Witch. On the face of it, this was an invasion with no purpose. I have, I hope, added some layers of intrigue and ultimate purpose to explain what's going on.

    The only concern I have about making the White Witch less obviously behind all of this is that we can't assume everyone reads every page, there needs to be extra clarity and redundancy to explain what's going on. Of course we can explain what is and also how it is understood by various parties, making it clear that most people just think the Kjarhoelle are on the move under a vigorous chief.

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