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  1. #1
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    Heyas all,

    My group have been playing a vosguard birthright campaign for over 4 months now and my DM has allowed me to be a Monk. However tons of questiosn has been brought up about this. The major one, which has stomped the DM and I, is what happens when a monk actually gets involved in politics and becomes a regent or creates a holding in support of one?

    What holds could monks create and should their be any penalties for it?
    It is argued that Monks are a combination of a lot of things so a Temple, Law and Guild are all somewhere in reach for a Monk. Guild because they're silent warriors that can do diplomacy, Law because they're melee and Temple due to the Western defination of a Monk.

    Any thoughts on this?

  2. #2
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    Originally posted by Imperiam@Apr 11 2004, 11:27 AM
    My group have been playing a vosguard birthright campaign for over 4 months now and my DM has allowed me to be a Monk. However tons of questiosn has been brought up about this. The major one, which has stomped the DM and I, is what happens when a monk actually gets involved in politics and becomes a regent or creates a holding in support of one?

    What holds could monks create and should their be any penalties for it?
    It is argued that Monks are a combination of a lot of things so a Temple, Law and Guild are all somewhere in reach for a Monk. Guild because they're silent warriors that can do diplomacy, Law because they're melee and Temple due to the Western defination of a Monk.

    Any thoughts on this?
    First of all, if you play the PHB Monk then IMO I could not see one emerging from Vosgaard. Tending to the inner Ki is rather difficult if brutal warriors rule and any sign of spirituality outside Beliniks or Krieshas church is persecuted.

    As for holdings I would say that a Monk should not be able to gain any RP from temples, simply because he is no divine spellcaster. "Because of the western definition of a monk" is a strange reason if you actually use the PHB Monk who is the opposite of a western definition of a monk. ;-)

    From the other holdings I would suggest that as in the original 2E rules such as Bard he should not be able to gain full RP from *any* holding, but for example half from law.
    bye
    Michael
    Michael Romes
    (Assan ibn Daouta in RoE)

  3. #3
    Senior Member Osprey's Avatar
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    In my brief but fun start of an Oriental Adventures Birthright, I made several new holding types to account for monks and other unique aspects of OA culture (my game was in the Japanese-type area of the OA continent, far across the Sea of Dragons...). These stsats were derived from the BRCS system.

    Schools [dojo] were introduced an entirely new holding type. Profession (Sensei) + Lead were the 2 key skills for determining regency collection (10+ ranks combined = 100% regency collection). Many kinds of schools exist: Gentleman's Academies, Martial Academies, martial arts and/or weapons Dojos [schools], mystical dojos...nearly any type of character could open a school, and blooded sensei [teachers] could gain RP from their schools. Like every other holding type, schools often engaged in heated competition for followers, and successful sensei would often have their best students open new schools teaching the Grandmaster's style, thus expanding the network of schools to become a domain. Schools generally charge adequate fees, often from the nobility, earning 2/3 x holding level in GB each season.

    Schools may raise troops as guilds and temples (holding level-2 GB per month), and may always build elite units over time. So a level 4 school could train 2GB worth of troops per month...in 3 months creating a 6 GB Monk unit (and those are fun on the battlefield, let me tell you! B) ).

    Schools may only contest other schools...if they wish to reduce any other holding type, they must typically resort to warfare, occupying and sacking a province (not unheard of for martial dojos) or other means (Espionage, Agitate, Diplomacy).

    Monasteries were another type of holding, but these compete directly with temples (as ascetic meditation can be just as faith-exclusive as deific worship). There are 3 main varieties of monasteries, though all function similarly: Classical (temple w/ monks and sohei), Mystical (often with shamans, shugenja, even wu-jen occasionally), and Martial (Yamabushi). At a domain level, Monasteries are different from temples in that their maximum holding level is equal to the province level OR current source potential of the province, whichever is higher.

    Classical monasteries are usually found in the more civilized areas, and function identically to temples at a domain level. The difference is that they are more inwardly focused, and often have a contingent of monks, nuns, and ascetics in addition to temple personell.

    The key skills for regents of Classical Monasteries are Diplomacy and Kn:Religion.

    Mystical monasteries are found in remote areas, and their level may not exceed the province's source potential. As shamans, shugenja, and wu-jen all are connected to the spirits of nature and the elements, these regents may control source holdings as Cerilian mages do, and the regent of a mystical monastery may gain regency from both the temple and source levels in the province. Mystical monasteries tend to recieve fewer pilgrims of wealth and status than others, and earn only 1/3 GB x level per season in revenues.

    The key skills for regents of Mystical Monasteries are Kn:Religion and Kn:Arcana.

    Martial monasteries have the Yamabushi warrior monks...sometimes small armies of them! They tend to be in remote areas, as most landed regents don't take too kindly to armies of elite fighting troops in the hearts of their domains (though some daimyo have strong alliances with the yamabushi monasteries). Martial monasteries are treated as Law holdings for the purpose of raising troops (1 GB muster per level of monastery), and earn 2/3 x level GB per season, as the local populace and pilgrims often give generously in exchange for the temple's benevolence and protection. Regents of remote martial monasteries often control the local Law holdings (limited by province level as normal) in addition to the temple levels, as they tend to be the dominant force of protection in the region. Some Yamabushi regents even invest the province itself, making remote mountain kingdoms isolated from the constant political struggles of the daimyos.

    The key skills regents of Martial Monasteries are Lead and Warcraft.


    Maybe you can mine some of those ideas for how monks might fit in elsewhere in Aebrynis, especially if they resemble the PHB monks in any way.

    Osprey

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    The way we worked out the existance of the Monk is that he comes from the sucluded northern hills in Khinasi and he's one of very few through out the ages that wonders away for whatever reason (Character has an interesting story). He adventures to vosguard and evenually finds the group's regent and joins him to explore possiablies. Well that evenually lead my Monk character to slowly become very interested in politics and supporting his regent. Mainly because the growing enemy of the regent, Temple of Belink(sp?) under one of the PC's control, PK'ed him. The regent paid to bring the monk back to life and the monk swore an oath of loyality to the regent and swore to get back at the temples. Thus creates a monk that wants politcal power. The regent wants the monk to go out and create a holding and establish is own power base to assist him. However, the DMs stated they have a hard time seeing how a monk could create and maintain a holding and if they do manage it what type of holdings they can create.

    I doubt they'll make new types of holdings since that'll complicate the campaign more...

    Also the reason why the monk hasn't been mobbed upon by the masses because he's a vasal of the regent and claims to suport his religion - Kriesha

  5. #5
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    What role does the monk class have in the setting? If its an unarmed

    fighter, a monk probabaly would control land and law like a normal fighter.

    If a monk is mostly a mystic, go with temples and law.



    D&D tends to throw all kinds of stuff together without an explanation of why

    these classes occur in the same setting, or why these monsters are located

    in the same place. I don`t know if anyone read the latest (May 2004) Wyrm`s

    Turn, but the Dragon`s editor describes a party composed of an air

    elemental, ogre mage, winged awakened deionychus, doppelganger, gold dragon,

    half-orc samuri, and a tauric dwarf-griffon.



    So, I would figure out what role in the setting a monk fills, and go from

    there in terms of holdings.



    Kenneth Gauck

    kgauck@mchsi.com

  6. #6
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Since he is one of very few monks that wonder away from the monastery the logic is in place for him not to gain regency from any holdings since he has never 'learned' how to rule any specific type of holding. From what I read of his background, the monks are specifically detached from the rest of the world, another factor in why he wouldn't gain from holdings. Kenneth is right and not right in his assertion to figure out what the character's role is in the world, actually it should be more what is the role of the monk's (as a class) in the campaign since regency from holdings (as you have presented it) is a class thing and not an individual character issue. He would of course still gain if he was a province ruler.

    Good luck in trying to find a way for a Khinasi PC to gain regency from a Vos ruled land.
    Duane Eggert

  7. #7
    Senior Member Osprey's Avatar
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    Mainly because the growing enemy of the regent, Temple of Belink(sp?) under one of the PC's control, PK'ed him. The regent paid to bring the monk back to life and the monk swore an oath of loyality to the regent and swore to get back at the temples. Thus creates a monk that wants politcal power.
    Which begs the question: If the monk was killed, and then brought back, how does he still have a bloodline? One of the major distinct themes of BR is that when you die you lose your bloodline, if you had one...and no ressurection will restore that. There are a very few magic items that can store one's bloodline upon death, but that's about the only way around the general problem as far as I know...unless your DM just waived that rule. Which is fine, I suppose, though it would drastically alter Cerilia as we know it if regents/scions could be brought back from death with bloodlines intact...

    Otherwise...has your character bloodthefted someone since coming back? This would be the other way to do it...and then only if he's lucky enough to become blooded in the act, which doesn't always happen.

    If he's not a blooded scion, the issue of ruling his own holdings becomes kinda' moot.

    Osprey

  8. #8
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    He managed to have/get a andurius bloodline after being brought back. It's only 12 +1 but I'm sure that's enough to rule.

  9. #9
    With a bloodline of just 12 it mayb better to use force rather than trying to contest the other regent out. Heh, in either case good luck.
    "Who was the first that forged the deadly blade? Of rugged steel his savage soul was made." --Tibullus

    "Qui desiderat pacem praeparet bellum." --Vegetius

    "Men grow tired of sleep, love, singing and dancing sooner than war." --Homer

  10. #10
    Senior Member ryancaveney's Avatar
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    On Sun, 11 Apr 2004, Osprey wrote:



    > In my brief but fun start of an Oriental Adventures Birthright, I made

    > several new holding types to account for monks and other unique aspects



    I fail to see why any change to the standard holding types is necessary.

    It seems to me that those are just standard guilds and temples with some

    variant window dressing. I understand the desire to change the flavor of

    the campaign, but why change the mechanics?





    Ryan Caveney

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