Heraldry

[Jaleela]

I used a wolf. A canton (play) on his ancestor's name.

[Arjan]

Work done to order! OK, not rampant guardant, but I need to find one in my library first. Drawing from scratch takes a long time.

very nice, PNG it and add it to the Diemed page :P

[Jaleela]

Here's the lion guardant.

[kgauck]

Different style of lion, didn't have to enlarge it too much, but its not terribly detailed. I'm probabaly gonna a keep working on the lion.

[kgauck]

The arms of Haelyn and Avani are terribly similar, both having suns on them. Any ideas about how to resolve that?

[ryancaveney]

The arms of Haelyn and Avani are terribly similar, both having suns on them. Any ideas about how to resolve that?

Avani is the sun, so she needs to keep it. Haelyn, as Anduiras before him, is an air god, not a fire one, so his arms should drop it. For air I'd normally lean towards an eagle, but that was Basaia's totem animal; Anduiras's was the lion. Therefore, since Haelyn is the god of rulership as well as Anduiras's heir, I'd base Haelyn's arms on a crowned lion.


Ryan

[kgauck]

I always had a problem with the fact that the air god gets a lion (an animal actually found in Khinasi) and the Khinasi god gets the flying animal.

The Empire was an eagle, Haelyn should be an eagle.

The whole thing sounds like design by commitee.

[Sorontar]

May I remind you of the arms in the British Isles which historically involve a kingdom that used a lion as its symbol (Scotland) and one that used a set of leopards (England). Realism is nothing. Symbolism is everything. Just look at the artwork in churches to see how disciples, ideologies and saints are linked to symbols, e.g. the cross, animals, five-pointed stars etc. Heraldry works hand-in-hand with that. If Lord Bloggs is known as Bloggs Terminator, he may want to have arms that have a hammer over a cockroach, as *everyone* in Cerilia knows that the cockroach is a devil of a beast. This heraldry would work regardless of the fact that Lord Bloggs lives up in the snowy alps where it is so cold that even 'roaches won't go there for their skiing holidays.

So according to Wikipedia, Scotland has the lion because King William I of Scotland was the Lion of Justice. England has various possible reasons of why it got the leopards, which are also lions but were called leopards in the French heraldic descriptions/blazons.

So if you need to think of new arms for somewhere or someone, think of what is representative of them, historically or current, and what the holder of the arms might like to be representative of them.

Sorontar
ps. I would *hate* to think of what arms the Anuireans would attribute to Rhoubhe Manslayer (who would of course reject the entire concept of needing such a thing as heraldry).

[kgauck]

Lions are kings of the beasts, and so suit Haelyn, except that he's also an air diety, so why not the king of the sky, the Eagle? If that was all that was at stake, its half a dozen of one, and six of the other. But the Empire is the eagle too. Why take the Imperial symbol from Basia rather than Haelyn?

The thing about Lions actually being in Khinasi only reinforces that there is a displacement issue here. Lions were cool because the heros of the Mediteranean, both Biblical and Classical fought Lions. Why do Anuireans like lions? Because they secretly admire Khinasi? Because all Anuirean heros really did the coolest stuff in Khinasi?

English and Scottish admiration of the Lion as kingly brings up Daniel and Herakles. What exactly are Anuireans thinking?

[Gman]

Haelyn an air god??

Not in his portfolio - Noble god of war etc


Can I have a reference.