Results 1 to 10 of 68
04-16-2007, 10:08 PM #1
Anuire. Since the purpose of heraldry is to identify someone clearly on a battlefield in dusty, confused, and hurried conditions, there is a need for clear, unambiguous blazons. But the PS do give us something interesting, its just figuring out what to do with it. I would figure that it either be the ancestory of the regent, or a geography of the realm, so its either a guide to families or places.
04-16-2007, 11:35 PM #2
(yay, I kicked off another thread!)
Certainly, the covers of the player's secrets books should probably be ignored. It's hard for me to imagine a troop of soldiers in, say, Ilien's heraldy - brown with half a dozen objects scattered across it. Bright colors are preferable, with two icons at most.
Since I've some free time, I'm going flip through my Ruins of Empire book to list known heraldries - sorry, I don't know all the official terms, and recommend ways they can be brought in line with real life heraldry/common sense.
04-16-2007, 11:42 PM #3
Another important use was the depiction of heraldry on seals. Here too, the clarity and simplicity of the symbols used was not of particular importance.
I also think that the use of heraldry as a means to distinguish friend from foe in battle would be difficult at best. Simple bright colours would be more useful to clearly identify each side.
Generic pikeman #111: "How the heck was I supposed to know that Sir Whatever was on our side? I've never seen his coat of arms before!"
As a side note, before heraldry became strictly regulated, coats of arms were apparently assumed at will and this is what probably happened in the case of Tuornen.
04-16-2007, 11:48 PM #4
So, based on Ruins of the Empire...
Roesone - Red field, black hart. Probably fine as is. *spends a minute oogling Marlae*
Aerenwe - Unknown - I think a tree on a white field would work nicely.
Diemed - Unknown. Yikes, we should get on this one. The lack of info on Diemed has always been vexing to me.
Ilien - Unknown - I'm going to pretend I never saw the cover of their book.
Medeore - Found on the cover of Player's Secrets book... why not simplify it to purple with a crescent moon, as befitting a Ruornite scoiety?
Mieres - Unknown - Something to signify their naval power? And they are on Aduria...
Boeruine - Behind the Archduke on p 22 is two lions facing one another on a purple field.
Talinie - The picture in Ruins of Empire shows a woman that we could assume is Thurienne Donalls, who wears a white surcoat with a blue bear. http://paizo.com/image/product/catal...R3109_500.jpeg is the cover of the Secrets book. If we were to go with that, it would probably usually be simplified to a green field with a stylized tudor-like rose.
Brosengae - Unknown
Taeghas - Unknown
Avan - Hmm... red field, orange two-headed hawk, modeled by Prince Avan himself. I might be inclined to lighten the orange a bit for some attractive contrast, but it seems alright otherwise.
Ghoere - Assuming that guy is Gavin Tael, he's got on a red surcoat with an orange... I think it's a dragon. His armor has a green hue to it, but that's less signficant. I don't like that its so similar to Avan's.
Mhoried - Quartered light blue/white, with swords and scales. I like it.
Tuornen - http://www.rpgnow.com/products/WOTC/tsr3107.jpg - needs a fix. We haven't seen a lot of blue so far - and the women in Ruins is wearing a blue cloak. Blue field, White hart?
Alamie - Unknown
Elinie - Unknown - White with a sunbursts, befitting the ruling family's faith?
Last edited by prince_dios; 04-16-2007 at 11:58 PM.
04-17-2007, 12:04 AM #5
Dhoesone - Unknown - The half-elven baroness seems to wearing a plain old hunting outfit. I like the idea of her heraldry(if we're assuming ancestral-based heraldry) incorporating Tuarhievel's hawk, though...
Cariele - Unknown
Coerayns - Unknown - a hammer and sickle? :P
Osoerde - Unknown
So anyways - and correct me if I'm off base...
1) The one-color fields indicate the less dominant parent's heraldry probably isn't reflected in one's coat of arms.
2) Strong preference for animals over objects(buildings, weapons, stars, gauntlets, and the like)
3) Little in the way of Heraldic lines and ordinaries
Last edited by prince_dios; 04-17-2007 at 12:31 AM.
04-17-2007, 12:29 AM #6
I'd agree that many of the depicted arms are bad/silly/too naturalistic, but I wouldn't oversimplify things.
With regard to Tuornen, IMO the symbols are okay, but the arrangement needs some work. Simply quartering the shield, with one symbol per quarter would probably look a lot better, but I would prefer moving the mug and the coins to the upper third of the shield (chief), dividing the rest of the shield horizontally (party per pale) and putting the stag's head on the right side (sinister) and the wheat sheaf on the left (dexter).
I also wouldn't ditch the tree trunk in Talinie's coat of arms as this symbolizes, according to the heraldry article in Dragon Magazine 275, p.59, something "worthy of veneration".
04-17-2007, 12:42 AM #7
04-17-2007, 01:00 AM #8
I would use a brighter, grassy green I guess.
Quoting from the already mentioned Dragon article (DR 275, p.52):
"Arms are represented by three main groups of tincture: colors, metals, and furs [...]; however, the actual hue of tincture is up to the artist depicting the blazon. This is a tradition that has continued since the time of Medieval heralds, who had to hand mix paints, thus making it nearly impossible to match colors between heralds."
Btw, green (vert) can symbolize hope, quite fitting for a new realm, while black (sable), the color of the dividing bend, can symbolize grief, also fitting given the origin of Tuornen.
04-17-2007, 01:44 AM #9
Black on Red or vice versa breaks most widely accepted rules of heraldry. Usually you have a metallic field (represented by white/silver and yellow/gold) and a colored charge, or the reverse.
The order is the field color and then the charge on it's most basic level. This does not go into ordinaries, subordinaries, stains, etc....
The Blazon (written or spoken aloud by a herald) for Boeruine would be: purpure, two lions combatant (rampant and facing each other) or, honour point a crown or.
I think Roesone is: Or and stag's head erased sable, or at least that's the badge that they seem to wear on the clothing.
For my campaign, I've created heraldry tables to roll up unique coats of arms. Those in the BRCS that made sense, I kept. The rest like Medore, and Ilien, I chucked.
Ghoere's would be gules (red) and wyvern/dragon or. See the metal on metal, color on color rule. While these do happen historically, they tend to be rare. The goal is to identify your adversary as well as your friends on the battlefield.
Historically a horrific gaff was made in the fog during the Barnet when Earl of Oxford's star with streamers banner was mistaken for Edward IV's Sunne in Splendour and the Lancastrians fell upon their own people. Ouch.
So it's important that you know the coats of arms of friend and foe alike. Also if your characters have livery colors and badges that are associated with your character.
Last edited by Jaleela; 04-17-2007 at 01:49 AM.
04-17-2007, 01:52 AM #10
Users Browsing this Thread
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)