Anuire before humans

[Aba]

1. How was Anuire, before the advent of humans? In particular, which lands were forested? For example, I read in the atlas of Cerilia that the Coulladaraight streched once unbroken all the way to the sea of dragons - probably then including the Sielwode and the Aelvinwode. If I had to guess, with the map of Anuire in front of me, I would say that these areas which are currently plains/hills were forested:
a. Kiergaard and Markazor - I see no other way to link the Coulladaraight to the Miere Rhuann.
b. Probably most of Mhoried (including Bevaldruor), northern Alamie and Tuornen, and all of Boeruine and Taeghas.
c. Perhaps all of southern Anuire? The Spiderfell and the Erebannien might be all that's left of the ancient forests in the area.

What do you think? And is there any "official" stuff on this?

Aba

[Doyle]

The impression that I get from the official texts is that Cerillia was
almost entirely forested. None of the races other than the humans had any
need for foresting - the Goblins perhaps a little, but prior to the humans
turning up and culling the elves, a clear field of elfin archery fire would
be one of the last things they would want.
The exception to this would be some (but not all) of the desert in the
Khinasi regions which seems to have been mostly present before the
Maesetians got there.

Doyle
----- Original Message -----
> Aba wrote:
> 1. How was Anuire, before the advent of humans? In particular, which
lands were forested? For example, I read in the atlas of Cerilia that the
Coulladaraight streched once unbroken all the way to the sea of dragons -
probably then including the Sielwode and the Aelvinwode. If I had to guess,
with the map of Anuire in front of me, I would say that these areas which
are currently plains/hills were forested:
> a. Kiergaard and Markazor - I see no other way to link the Coulladaraight
to the Miere Rhuann.
> b. Probably most of Mhoried (including Bevaldruor), northern Alamie and
Tuornen, and all of Boeruine and Taeghas.
> c. Perhaps all of southern Anuire? The Spiderfell and the Erebannien might
be all that`s left of the ancient forests in the area.
>
> What do you think? And is there any "official" stuff on this?
>
> Aba

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[Birthright-L]

I say that much of this land is still wooded, at least by modern standards.

In pre-industrial land useage, a lot of what is technically farmland is
actually forested. Only about 1/4 or the land area is cultivated, 1/4 is
fallow and the rest is used for logging, livestock and so on.

Hom much of this land is actually forest varies from locale to locale. Some
lands are natural plains - creating a lackof timber. But much of it is
wooded. So even a "plans" province contains something like 25-50% woodlands.

Of course, there is a huge difference between such domestic woodlands and
the true "forest" that the elves value.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Aba" <brnetboard@TUARHIEVEL.ORG>
To: <BIRTHRIGHT-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 2:06 AM
Subject: Anuire before humans [2#1096]


> This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
> You can view the entire thread at:
http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1096
>
> Aba wrote:
> 1. How was Anuire, before the advent of humans? In particular, which
lands were forested? For example, I read in the atlas of Cerilia that the
Coulladaraight streched once unbroken all the way to the sea of dragons -
probably then including the Sielwode and the Aelvinwode. If I had to guess,
with the map of Anuire in front of me, I would say that these areas which
are currently plains/hills were forested:
> a. Kiergaard and Markazor - I see no other way to link the Coulladaraight
to the Miere Rhuann.
> b. Probably most of Mhoried (including Bevaldruor), northern Alamie and
Tuornen, and all of Boeruine and Taeghas.
> c. Perhaps all of southern Anuire? The Spiderfell and the Erebannien might
be all that`s left of the ancient forests in the area.
>
> What do you think? And is there any "official" stuff on this?
>
> Aba
>
>
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[ConjurerDragon]

Hello!

Aba wrote:

>This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
> You can view the entire thread at: http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1096
>Aba wrote:
> 1. How was Anuire, before the advent of humans? In particular, which lands were forested? For example, I read in the atlas of Cerilia that the Coulladaraight streched once unbroken all the way to the sea of dragons - probably then including the Sielwode and the Aelvinwode. If I had to guess, with the map of Anuire in front of me, I would say that these areas which are currently plains/hills were forested:
>a. Kiergaard and Markazor - I see no other way to link the Coulladaraight to the Miere Rhuann.
>
The sea of dragons is not the Miere Rhuann, that´s the "sea of storms"
in the WEST of Cerilia. The Sea of Dragons is in the EAST of Cerilia, so
the Coulladraight would not have to have extended west, when using the
sentence that it once stretched to the Sea of dragons. And so it would
not have to have covered Kiergaard and Markazor.

>b. Probably most of Mhoried (including Bevaldruor), northern Alamie and Tuornen, and all of Boeruine and Taeghas.
>c. Perhaps all of southern Anuire? The Spiderfell and the Erebannien might be all that`s left of the ancient forests in the area.
>
>What do you think? And is there any "official" stuff on this?
>
The only thing I remember immediately is in the description of Rhuobhe
Manslayer - there it is mentioned that he was once a friend of humans
when the forests of the Aelvinnwode still reached to the Maesil River.
That would mean that the whole of the old Duchy of Tuornen had to be
forested.
bye
Michael

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[Birthright-L]

On Wed, 20 Nov 2002, Michael Romes wrote:
> The only thing I remember immediately is in the description of Rhuobhe
> Manslayer - there it is mentioned that he was once a friend of humans
> when the forests of the Aelvinnwode still reached to the Maesil River.
> That would mean that the whole of the old Duchy of Tuornen had to be
> forested.

Probably Alamie and Mhoried, too. I figured the forest went from its
current extent, over the whole heartlands, southern coast, and eastern
marshes regions. The erebannian was once part of the Aelvinwode, right?
--
Communication is possible only between equals.
Daniel McSorley- mcsorley@cis.ohio-state.edu

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[Aba]

>The sea of dragons is not the Miere Rhuann, that´s the "sea of
>storms" in the WEST of Cerilia. The Sea of Dragons is in the EAST of
> Cerilia, so the Coulladraight would not have to have extended west,
> when using the sentence that it once stretched to the Sea of
>dragons. And so it would not have to have covered Kiergaard and
>Markazor.

I made a mistake in typing my previous post, but the point I was making remains the same: according to the atlas of Cerilia, the Coulladaraight "once streched unbroken from the Miere Rhuann to the Sea of Dragons", so it DID stretch all the way to the Miere Rhuann - and so Kiergaard and Markazor MUST have been forested at some point.

>The only thing I remember immediately is in the description of
>Rhuobhe Manslayer - there it is mentioned that he was once a friend
>of humans when the forests of the Aelvinnwode still reached to the
>Maesil River.
>That would mean that the whole of the old Duchy of Tuornen had to
> be forested.

If the Aelvinwode streched all the way to the Maesil, then it was probably was also connected to the Spiderfell (from the Player's secrets of Endier, Endier seems to have been forested before Richard Endier claimed it from the Spider).

If we "fill in" small gaps then, it's likely that at least all of Anuire northwest of the Maesil, from where now the imperial city stands all the way to the Sielwode was more or less densely forested, in addition to, at least, northwestern Diemed, the Spiderfell, Endier and western Ghoere.

Taking into account the Erebannien then, it seems reasonable to "fill in" the rest of Diemed, Medoere, Ilien, Roesone, Aerenwe and the rest of Ghoere- in other words it looks to me as if all of Anuire was probably forested west Elinie and Osoerde.

Whether Coeranys, Elinie and Osoerde where always flat, swampy plains, or also were in large part forested like the rest of Anuire, I cannot say.

Any other thoughts?

Aba

[kgauck]

Frankly in determining what Anuire looked like before the peoples came, I`d run
the continent through a weather model.

http://fp.bio.utk.edu/bot120lect/Biomes/biomemap.htm
this link shows the biomes of North America.

http://www.cyber.vt.edu/geog1014/topics/10...limate/cli.html
has a world map.

I tend to assume a European type of scenario. Southern Anuire has a
mediterranean climate, the Taelshore and the west coast of Anuire have the
Marine - West Coast climate. Starting north and east of Mhoried, the
continental climte (called Cool Forest on the world map) takes over. Khinasi
lands are mostly warm steppe. I tend to think that the planet is a bit smaller
to accomodate greater extreams of warm and cold so close to each other, but its
not so obvious as to make players think the planet must be the size of Mercury
or something.

Based on these assumptions, the South Coast (even before it was quite so
coastal) would have scrub forest, with smaller trees than you find in deciduous
or coniferous forests. Think Greek and Italian forests.

I agree with the earlier poster that said a certain amont of wooded area would
occur on terrain types other than strait out forest (just like forests will
include glens, meadows, and other things other than pure tree). Nevertheless,
I don`t see much forest-dwelling elf culture in Binsada or Ayria.

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[Ariadne]

Originally posted by kgauck

Nevertheless, I don`t see much forest-dwelling elf culture in Binsada or Ayria.

If I think of Khinasi, I think of the "Arabian nights". Binsada is a big desert with some oasis in, Ariya has planes and the north of it is a little like "Indian reservation" (red mountains, red sand and a little bit dry). Aftane is drier than Ariya, but no compartment to the "tarvan wastes".

Forrests in the south of Khinasi don't exist, I think.

Anuire is a little bit like the European middle age, I think (naturally including the climate).

[ConjurerDragon]

Hello!

Aba wrote:

>This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
> You can view the entire thread at: http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1096
>Aba wrote:I made a mistake in typing my previous post, but the point I was making remains the same: according to the atlas of Cerilia, the Coulladaraight "once streched unbroken from the Miere Rhuann to the Sea of Dragons", so it DID stretch all the way to the Miere Rhuann - and so Kiergaard and Markazor MUST have been forested at some point.
>
Right, I commented only on the sentence as you used it, I did not look
up the sentence in the Atlas.

>>The only thing I remember immediately is in the description of
>>Rhuobhe Manslayer - there it is mentioned that he was once a friend
>>of humans when the forests of the Aelvinnwode still reached to the
>>Maesil River.
>>That would mean that the whole of the old Duchy of Tuornen had to
>>be forested.
>>
>If the Aelvinwode streched all the way to the Maesil, then it was probably was also connected to the Spiderfell (from the Player`s secrets of Endier, Endier seems to have been forested before Richard Endier claimed it from the Spider).
>If we "fill in" small gaps then, it`s likely that at least all of Anuire northwest of the Maesil, from where now the imperial city stands all the way to the Sielwode was more or less densely forested, in addition to, at least, northwestern Diemed, the Spiderfell, Endier and western Ghoere.
>Taking into account the Erebannien then, it seems reasonable to "fill in" the rest of Diemed, Medoere, Ilien, Roesone, Aerenwe and the rest of Ghoere- in other words it looks to me as if all of Anuire was probably forested west Elinie and Osoerde.
>Whether Coeranys, Elinie and Osoerde where always flat, swampy plains, or also were in large part forested like the rest of Anuire, I cannot say.
>Any other thoughts?
>
At least in Michael Roeles time, which is a good time ago but not before
human settlement, he had experienced problems in the swamps of Coeranys
with the Duchess who did first not want to become his vassal. That was
somewhere in "Iron Throne" Novel if I remember it right. If the swamps
were there 500 years ago, they could have been there 1500 years ago...
bye
Michael

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[kgauck]

> If the swamps were there 500 years ago, they could have
> been there 1500 years ago...

True, these swamps could be primeval. But, they could also be the result of
deforestation and plow agriculture upstream. In historical time, the mouth of
the Tigris and Euphrates as well as the Indus and the Huang Ho rivers have all
moved as much as 200 miles into the sea, because of the large amounts of soil
carried downstream. This new land downsteam is generally a variety of swamp,
bog, or marsh.

Kenneth Gauck
kgauck@mchsi.com

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