House rules regarding rule province

[irdeggman]

Lol?I specifically said the ONLY bonus was 1 xp.The campaign does NOT end.You do not gain any fame or honour for killing him.Everything continues as normal except the players go "WTF i killed the gorgon and got 1 xp?I should be emperor of anuire FFS."

Nothing?

I would award a Great Heritage Template to the character (and thus his decendents). The family of the person who killed the Gogon definitely deserves such honor. (Note this is DM fiat so no LA for it).

[Question]

Well thats reasonable obviously.......but im referring to a situation of "lets make doing something useless so no one will want to do it!".

I still want to know if its allowed to spend GB to support a rule province action.

[irdeggman]

Well thats reasonable obviously.......but im referring to a situation of "lets make doing something useless so no one will want to do it!".

I still want to know if its allowed to spend GB to support a rule province action.

First off I don't really know what you mean by a useless action - since the one you pointed out I gave an example of a benefit to be provided.

As far as using GB to modify a rule province action - the answer is no. In fact you can't use GB to modify any rule action. The only times GB can be used to modify an action are when it is specifically spelled out in the action, e.g., Diplomacy.

In fact for a Rule Province action no one other the than the regent performing the action can use any RP to support or oppose the action. the actual text says that RP can't be used to support, but it actually means that other regents can't use any.

Standard domain action: Each domain normally is allowed one standard domain action per domain round. A regent's standard domain action represents the primary focus or goal of the regent's court and agents for the domain round. The regent need not be physically present for his domain to take a standard action; only routine communication is required. If the regent is unable to communicate to his realm, the character's player should still be allowed to select a reasonable domain action for the domain that represents the court's attempts to maintain the realm in the regent's absence. A regent's court can be reasonably expected to perform the same actions as the regent would; a regent's courtiers make it their business to have a fair idea of the regent's opinions on important matters. A regent can spend regency to support his domain's standard domain actions, regardless of his personal involvement.





In addition, other holdings of the same type as your active holding can support or oppose your action. Using holdings to oppose or support another regent's actions is not a domain action. Allied holdings of the same type provide a bonus equal to their level. Opposed holdings of the same type provide a penalty equal to their level. Holdings of different types cannot add or subtract their level to your check. Any applicable regent may order such support or opposition once he is aware of the action. Support from holding level is highly visible, all regents (and residents) of the area will be aware of the regent's support, opposition, or apathy regarding the action.

Regency Points:

+1 per RP spent to support, -1 per RP spent to oppose. Regents may spend RP to support or oppose most domain action checks. The province regent and any regent that has any holding of any level in the province in which the domain action is taking place may spend RP to support or oppose the action. There is no limit (save availability) to how many RP may be spent to support or oppose an action.

Spending RP to support or oppose an action is done in reverse domain initiative order. Each eligible regent may spend RP to support or oppose the domain action check. Each regent must be offered the opportunity to spend regency each round. Bidding continues round by round, until a round passes in which no regent bids additional RP, a which point the domain action check can be made.

Although it is obvious when a holding level opposes or supports an action, the spending of RP is not necessarily so. RP can be spent "anonymously" at the regent's desire. The player is always aware of the RP being spent against them (and can use this information during bidding), but the character may not be aware of the mastermind behind the forces opposing his action.





The base DC for the domain action is 10 + the current level of your province. Unlike most standard actions, no holding levels can be applied to support or oppose this action and RP cannot be spent to support or oppose the action. A court can only take this action once per domain turn. Regardless of whether this action fails or succeeds, an additional attempt to Rule Province (even a different province) in the same domain turn automatically fails.

[Thomas_Percy]

Well thats reasonable obviously.......but im referring to a situation of "lets make doing something useless so no one will want to do it!".

No one wants to kill The Gorgon and nobody even wanted from one and half milenium because there is only 1XP reward.

[Question]

Major miscommunication problem.

Firstly i was under the assumption you cant use RP to modify rule provinces.So i was like "you cant modify it already and you want to nerf it somemore?WTF?" hence my example of ruling level 4 to 5 taking 4 turns,etc,etc.

At any rate most PBEMs nerf it to HELL anyway,needing 2 years IRL to get back your investment is obviously an over nerf,and they might as well outlaw the action TOTALLY.

My example of the gorgon was an analogy of this...since no one is going to try to kill the gorgon for 1 xp why not just outright say "hey you cant kill the gorgon,he instantly kills you with uber h4x".

I am not saying gorgon is useless to kill under standard rules,it was just an analogy.

[Osprey]

In reply to Duane:

As far as using GB to modify a rule province action - the answer is no. In fact you can't use GB to modify any rule action. The only times GB can be used to modify an action are when it is specifically spelled out in the action, e.g., Diplomacy.

Also Agitate - the only action in the BRCS where GB affect the action on a 1 for 1 basis.

In fact for a Rule Province action no one other the than the regent performing the action can use any RP to support or oppose the action. the actual text says that RP can't be used to support, but it actually means that other regents can't use any.

I have always been under the assumption that "RP cannot be spent to support or oppose this action" meant just that - why should the regent performing the action be the sole exception to this statement? It makes no sense from a game balance point of view, as ruling provinces then becomes ridiculously easy.

Also you quoted,

Regents may spend RP to support or oppose most domain action checks.

But not necessarily all domain action checks. Leaving us with the impression that there are exceptions to the general rule, and Rule Province seems to me to be the obvious one.
Allowing only one regent to support an action with RP, but no one oppose him, is horribly unbalanced, and just plain broken. I have a hard time imagining the author intended as you believe, it's just too blatantly broken.

In any case, I feel fairly confident that most every other BR player I've ever discussed the BRCS Rule Province action with (mainly here on the forums) was under the same assumption as I was, that RP may not affect the action at all.

Osprey

[Question]

Yea im thinking chapter 5 needs to be revised and correct wording implemented.

I believe source mages should be able to bid RP to oppose rule provinces, but ONLY if the rule action would cause his source to go down in level,so no lame "level 0 source stopping 2/9 province from ruling" scenarios.

Now as to why nobody should be able to oppose it.........why not?Its not like its a BAD thing for the other regents around......with possible exceptions of source regents.In fact most regents would want the ruler to rule the province.More province levels = more holding levels for temple/guild regents = more money/RP for them.This works out perfectly well for them.The only other exception to this rule i can think of are hostile law holders,in which case it might be worthwhile to allow law holding rulers to either support or oppose this action.

As to it being easy......im examing the context from a PBEM point of view, seeing as how BR is rarely played IRL anymore(to my knowledge at least).

Ruling province level 4 to 5.DC 14.4 GB.12 RP spent to support this check.Assuming no one opposes it under the rules i propose, and assuming you consider 1 GB equavelent to 1 RP,you get back your investment in 8 turns, or 8 months IRL,assuming 1 month = 1 turn and turn resolution is instant.Considering extensions, turn processing, etc it usaully means 1 year instead.

1 year to get back your investment before making any profit does not seem "easy" to me.

Of course you can factor in your administrate skill but thats capped your level +3.....otherwise you can(thereotically) get regents with very high bonuses to the check from administrate and full domain actions.In most cases it is highly unlikely the bonus exceeds +4.

There is of course the matter of the feats but most players/DMs consider them absolute cheese and far too overpowering, and some have removed it completely from their games, which does make the rule actions much more difficult and costly to achieve.In fact those feats might need a looking at.......