Population Growth

[Robert Harper]

A question:

Say the dwarven ruler of Baruk-azhik Rules one of his middle provinces from
4 to 5 to 6. That means the population has gone from around 10,000 to 40,000.

Where did those 30,000 dwarves come from in 6 months? This is a
slow-reproducing race, of which there are not many.

In human lands, more heavily populated provinces would constantly throw off
"fodder" for development without suffering. But how do the smaller nations
of elves and dwarves, with low birth rates, justify the possible population
growth?

For elves I don't have a problem. I rule that they live in harmony with
nature. This means their development does not harm Source, but cannot go
over 4.

For dwarves, I'm not sure what to do.

__________________________________________________ _________________
| |
| We ask ourselves if there is a God, how can this happen? |
| Better to ask, if there is a God, must it be sane? |
| |
| Lucien LaCroix |
|_________________________________________________ __________________|

[Undertaker]

At 10:55 PM 1/13/97 -0500, Robert Harper(rob.harper@sympatico.ca)wrote:
>
>Say the dwarven ruler of Baruk-azhik Rules one of his middle provinces from
>4 to 5 to 6. That means the population has gone from around 10,000 to 40,000.
>
>Where did those 30,000 dwarves come from in 6 months? This is a
>slow-reproducing race, of which there are not many.
>
>In human lands, more heavily populated provinces would constantly throw off
>"fodder" for development without suffering. But how do the smaller nations
>of elves and dwarves, with low birth rates, justify the possible population
>growth?
>

This is a good question. I've given thought to alot of thought to the
various Actions a character can perform. With many of them a DM has to make
sure the Action is actually feasible. That is to say they must have the
supplies available that an Action might require, before they can undertake
it. In this case a Ruler should not be able to increase their Province,
without the right conditions, say a boom in marriages last year, an
immigration of nearby peoples, etc. Even then the growth of the Province
should be kept within logical reason. A jump in Dwarven population by
30,000(from 10,000 to 40,000)has to impossible. Maybe they could double
their population, but it should still take slightly longer then 1, or 2 DTs
for it to happen. Thats my 2 cents.

Undertaker, richt@metrolink.net
RL Homepage: http://www.metrolink.net/~veleda/sepulcher.html

[Jaanus Lillenberg]

Hey

You wrote:
>
> A question:
>
> Say the dwarven ruler of Baruk-azhik Rules one of his middle provinces from
> 4 to 5 to 6. That means the population has gone from around 10,000 to 40,000.
>
> Where did those 30,000 dwarves come from in 6 months? This is a
> slow-reproducing race, of which there are not many.
>
> In human lands, more heavily populated provinces would constantly throw off
> "fodder" for development without suffering. But how do the smaller nations
> of elves and dwarves, with low birth rates, justify the possible population
> growth?
>
> For elves I don't have a problem. I rule that they live in harmony with
> nature. This means their development does not harm Source, but cannot go
> over 4.
>
> For dwarves, I'm not sure what to do.

My solution to the problem of population growth is quite simple,
althought it may raise several questionabilities about it.

If a dwarven province will be raised from 4 to 6 it is about 30 000
individuals to come. I would rule it simply. Those 30 thousand are
dwarves coming from elsewhere searching the refuge from their racemates.
It may be done once or twice, but not a lot of times.

Now when you have province of six. It still reproduces the people
somehow faster and raising other provinces won't be that hard.

All the same would go about elves... only perhaps such rise (4 to 6)
may be commited only once. In the north there are heavily populated elven
provinces in Lluabraight so maximum province level of 4 wouldn't be
correct.

Sincerely Yours
Jaanus Lillenberg
- ---
jaanusl@postimees.ee

[Brian Green]

About Dwarves growing, etc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I got the impression from the Baruk-Azhik
PS that the Dwarves were actually a pretty fast breeding race. It's
just that the constant wars against the Orogs, etc, "thin the herd" so
to speak.

Perhaps the Ruler calls for a cease-fire and allows all the poor
warriors to go home. Can anyone say "Baby boom"? :)

I could be wrong....

"And I now wait / to shake the hand of fate...." -"Defender", Manowar
Brian Green, pchild@iastate.edu aka Psychochild
|\ _,,,---,,_ *=* Morpheus, my kitten, says "Hi!" *=*
ZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ "If you two are so evil, then why don't
|,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' you just...EAT THIS KITTEN!"
'---''(_/--' `-'\_) - "The Tick", Saturday morning cartoon.
Check out: http://www.public.iastate.edu/~pchild to find out more 'bout me!

[rcantin@oricom.ca (Robin]

Abut fast-raising population of a province, Jaanus Lillenberg replied to -
I don't have a clue who -

>> Say the dwarven ruler of Baruk-azhik Rules one of his middle provinces from
>> 4 to 5 to 6. That means the population has gone from around 10,000 to
>>40,000.
>>
>> Where did those 30,000 dwarves come from in 6 months? This is a
>> slow-reproducing race, of which there are not many.
>>
>> In human lands, more heavily populated provinces would constantly throw off
>> "fodder" for development without suffering. But how do the smaller nations
>> of elves and dwarves, with low birth rates, justify the possible population
>> growth?
(...)
>My solution to the problem of population growth is quite simple,
>althought it may raise several questionabilities about it.
>
>If a dwarven province will be raised from 4 to 6 it is about 30 000
>individuals to come. I would rule it simply. Those 30 thousand are
>dwarves coming from elsewhere searching the refuge from their racemates.
>It may be done once or twice, but not a lot of times.
>Now when you have province of six. It still reproduces the people
>somehow faster and raising other provinces won't be that hard.

Okay, just because you raise your province level by two over a six-month
period, I don't think we should consider the province's population
quadrupled in six months. I take the population equivalents (p. 33 RB) as
being the population the province would normally support given its
development level, exploitation of natural resources, etc.

So what happends to your province upgraded from 4 to 6 is a tremendous
economic development, a sharp demand for labour and plenty of
opportunities. The population will eventually reach 40 000 after a few
years, due to continued emigration and births.

That's the way I see it - development first, population follows over a
period of time.

-

[Jaanus Lillenberg]

Hello list

This time I write FIRST and leave the already-written for NEXT.

The WHY, I answered was somebody was discussing about the numbers.
I hadn't the book with me to check if those numbers were right.
I agree you, Robin, that raising in province level is first of all
the economic development and then afterwards the population slowly
grows as long as there are enough resources for society to behave that
way.

Yours
Jaanus Lillenberg
- ---
jaanusl@postimees.ee

>
Robin wrote:
>
> Abut fast-raising population of a province, Jaanus Lillenberg replied to -
> I don't have a clue who -
>
> >> Say the dwarven ruler of Baruk-azhik Rules one of his middle provinces from
> >> 4 to 5 to 6. That means the population has gone from around 10,000 to
> >>40,000.
> >>
> >> Where did those 30,000 dwarves come from in 6 months? This is a
> >> slow-reproducing race, of which there are not many.
> >>
> >> In human lands, more heavily populated provinces would constantly throw off
> >> "fodder" for development without suffering. But how do the smaller nations
> >> of elves and dwarves, with low birth rates, justify the possible population
> >> growth?
> (...)
> >My solution to the problem of population growth is quite simple,
> >althought it may raise several questionabilities about it.
> >
> >If a dwarven province will be raised from 4 to 6 it is about 30 000
> >individuals to come. I would rule it simply. Those 30 thousand are
> >dwarves coming from elsewhere searching the refuge from their racemates.
> >It may be done once or twice, but not a lot of times.
> >Now when you have province of six. It still reproduces the people
> >somehow faster and raising other provinces won't be that hard.
>
> Okay, just because you raise your province level by two over a six-month
> period, I don't think we should consider the province's population
> quadrupled in six months. I take the population equivalents (p. 33 RB) as
> being the population the province would normally support given its
> development level, exploitation of natural resources, etc.
>
> So what happends to your province upgraded from 4 to 6 is a tremendous
> economic development, a sharp demand for labour and plenty of
> opportunities. The population will eventually reach 40 000 after a few
> years, due to continued emigration and births.
>
> That's the way I see it - development first, population follows over a
> period of time.
>
>