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  1. #1
    Site Moderator Ariadne's Avatar
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    Hi there,

    after searching through the cerilian pantheon I found serveral portfolios missing. (May be they are there, but I didn't find them.)

    In my oppinion there is no deity with the portfolios: Healing/ medicine, birth/ fertility/ motherhood, knowlege/ learning, disease, foresight, life, death, home/ marriage, murder, undead, etc.

    On the other hand there are portfolios twice or more times: war/ conflict, warriors and maybe more (in the moment I can't remember all of them).

    It might be, that some of the non-existing portfolios can be added to several deities (Nesirie, Avani, Kriesha, Ruornil), but adding these portfolios can't be compatible with the fact of so many lesser deities.

    The fact of sharing portfolios is based on three war gods: Haelyn, Cuiraécen and Belinik. They may have different ways of seeing war, but they wave the same portfolio!
    May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!

  2. #2
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    I recently pointed out (in other threads) that the distribution of portfolios in cerilia is not perfectly solved. this results in an unbalanced pantheon. maybe it reflects only the chaotic situation of the ascension of gods...
    my purpose is now to lead you into the Pallace where you shall have a clear and delightful view of all those various objects, and scattered excellencies, that lye up and down upon the face of creation, which are only seen by those that go down into the Seas, and by no other....

  3. #3
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    On Tue, 16 Jul 2002 brnetboard@TUARHIEVEL.ORG wrote:
    > after searching through the cerilian pantheon I found serveral
    > portfolios missing. (May be they are there, but I didn`t find them.)
    >
    > In my oppinion there is no deity with the portfolios: Healing/
    > medicine, birth/ fertility/ motherhood, knowlege/ learning, disease,
    > foresight, life, death, home/ marriage, murder, undead, etc.

    Gods in cerilia are cultural representatives or archetypes, not FR-style
    narrowly specialized `portfolio` gods. In Rjurik, Erik would be
    responsible for medicine, birth, knowledge, life, death, etc. No one
    there wants to give offerings to murder; if they do, they might follow
    Belenik, wanton destruction, or Eleole, sneakiness.

    Undeath is abhorred and related to the shadow world; nowhere on Cerilia
    will you find a god that promotes it.

    In Anuire, Haelyn rules life and nobility, Nesirie his consort might be
    seen as the mother goddess, watching over birth and marriage. In Khinasi,
    Avani rules her pantheon.

    > The fact of sharing portfolios is based on three war gods: Haelyn,
    > Cuiraécen and Belinik. They may have different ways of seeing war, but
    > they wave the same portfolio!

    You seem to think this is a problem. In greek myth, Ares was god of war.
    Zeus and Posiedon favored armies with lightning and aid from the sea (and
    horses). Athena was the goddess of wisdom and strategy. Hephaestus
    and his cyclops forged weapons. Nearly all the gods took part in battles
    at various times.
    --
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  4. #4
    Orginally posted by Birthright-L

    On Tue, 16 Jul 2002 brnetboard@TUARHIEVEL.ORG wrote:
    Gods in cerilia are cultural representatives or archetypes, not FR-style
    narrowly specialized `portfolio` gods. In Rjurik, Erik would be
    responsible for medicine, birth, knowledge, life, death, etc.
    Exactly, the human cultures in Cerilia are so varied that if you wanted a "marriage deity" you would have to create one for each dissimilar culture. The Khinasi version might support polygamy, while the Anuirean deity would be horrified at the idea. In the end this would result in an FR conglameration of deities that does not carry the flavor of Birthright.

    I see Cerilia as being made up of regional monotheisms, where one deity is accorded supreme status and the others carry a cult-like following similar to those of some catholic saints. They are revered but are clearly inferior to the dominant power. The dominant deity of a region is defined by the values of its people.

  5. #5
    Site Moderator Ariadne's Avatar
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    Orginally posted by Birthright-L

    Undeath is abhorred and related to the shadow world; nowhere on Cerilia
    will you find a god that promotes it.
    I think a goddess like Kriesha should promote it, she is the only who let her clerics rebuke them and is evil herself. Additionally Khiesha is may be the only goddess, who can take the portfolios disease and death (in evil form), but as I pointed out she shouldn't be a lesser goddess then.

    By the way Ruornil stands a little bit for Undead (o.K. the fight against them).

    Orginally posted by Birthright-L
    You seem to think this is a problem. In greek myth, Ares was god of war.
    Zeus and Poseidon favored armies with lightning and aid from the sea (and
    horses). Athena was the goddess of wisdom and strategy. Hephaestus
    and his cyclops forged weapons. Nearly all the gods took part in battles
    at various times.
    You are right and I don't have realy a problem with it (I prefer Cuiraécen myself), but it is in my oppinion a little bit unbalanced, if there are portfolios twice and other non-existent.
    May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!

  6. #6
    Orginally posted by Ariadne

    You are right and I don't have realy a problem with it (I prefer Cuiraécen myself), but it is in my oppinion a little bit unbalanced, if there are portfolios twice and other non-existent.
    Overemphasis like this can be seen as highlighting the more prominant aspects of the campaign world and its cultures. Military conflict and noble rulership are obviously a major part of the Birthright campaign, and having several war deities serves to bring this tendency out into the foreground.

  7. #7
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    Bearcat is right in what he said about the monotheisms, though I would not put it so harshly. In the various regions one god is considered supreme and the others inferior to him, but I would not put them so low as to resemble saints. Anyway....

    The rjuriks for instance believe that when they die, they become a part of nature and they go to Erik. They do not even believe that they have a soul, like the Anuireans do. This means that Erik is the death god, the birth god and all the other stuff that Bercat and Daniel said. He is even the family god, since in Rjurik, they follow the patriarchical type. He is the patron of his people and that means that he takes on many roles in their society and is not limited to the very strict portfolio he is given.

    I don't think I really have more to add (well, perhaps that even Apollo was fighting alongside the trojans). The people who spoke before me have already said all I would say :)

  8. #8
    Site Moderator Ariadne's Avatar
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    O.K., O.K., may be you are right with the thing of one supreme god for every region. But why they grant so few spell-spheres then (2nd Edition only)?

    @ Bearcat:
    I didn't say war (military conflict and noble rulership) is the only portfolio that exists several times. Magic (Avani and Ruornil) and Night (Eloele and Ruornil) are have the same "problem"...
    May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!

  9. #9
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    Ruornil is the god of mystical places or sources if you want and he is a god of magic with this specific task. He is also the keeper of the Oath.

    Avani on the other hand is a patron for mages and she is revered as a godess of magic mostly in Khinasi and not in Anuire or Brechtur, where they focus more on the aspect of Logic or Sun.

    Ruornil is the Moon Lord and Eloele the Mistress of the Night. They don't overlap. eg in greek mythology, Artemis was the moon godess but Erebos or some other lesser deity was the Night god, not Artemis.

  10. #10
    Orginally posted by Ariadne

    @ Bearcat:
    I didn't say war (military conflict and noble rulership) is the only portfolio that exists several times. Magic (Avani and Ruornil) and Night (Eloele and Ruornil) are have the same "problem"...
    I don't have any of the books accessible at this point, but isn't Eleole the daughter of Ruornil and Sera? If this is the case, then some of this thematic repitition is based upon offspring deity's affinity for their parents domains. Thus Eleole combines Ruornil's affinity for night time and Sera's affinity for wealth into a shodwy thiefy deity. Cuiraecen on the other hand brings in Haelyn's penchant for battle and Nesirie's chaotic oceanness into a storm/battle deity.

    Perhaps theres some divine version of DNA at work here.

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