Results 1 to 7 of 7
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    883
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    p. 129 Charge Attack
    "Pike units attack damage during this phase for the first round of any
    engagement only."

    ?
    Perhaps is meant that "Pike units attack in the Charge Phase for the first
    round of any single engagement only."

    That makes Pikemen more powerful than in 2E. In 2E they had +1 to attack and
    defence vs. mounted and simply could not be charged, and so exchanged blows
    with cavalry and knights only in the melee phase. Now they attack in the
    same phase as the Charge, so before any melee takes place - however that
    means that they can attack not-mounted units also before they can attack
    back in the melee phase, right?
    And it is a very powerful change in that mounted units are forced to charge
    Pikemen if they want to exchange blows in the same phase - if they attack
    normally they do not only lose the charge bonus, but also attack AFTER they
    suffer the Pikemens attack.


    Also the problem is the Knights charge attack: In the part about "Charge
    Attack" is the same example about knights as in the 2E rulebook (charging,
    meeting in the middle of the field). However that assumes that Knights have
    a movement of 2 - now they have 3 (as Cavalry 3, Heavy Armour -2, Veteran +2
    = 3. The example is no longer valid and knights - as long as they are
    veteran knights, can charge to the other side of the battlefield in the
    first move.
    This was not possible until now, and only the Cavalry could do this. The
    example would be still valid only for standard knights, however under
    Anuirean units Veteran Knights as common unit are listed as far as I understood.


    "Ending the battle" on same page:
    Why has the rule been dropped (at least I could not find it) that an army
    retreating from the battlefield is subject to being attacked by mounted
    units of the victor and killing 1 retreating unit for each mounted unit
    which is not countered by mounted units of the retrating army? There should
    be a punishment for being forced to retreat once the battle started - after
    all one can retreat before the battle starts...


    Fortifications:
    Fortresses have become more expensive at higher levels as they no longer
    cost a flat 1 GB but 2/3 GB per level. Why then has the "garrison" unit been
    erased which defends the fortress in 2E when no friendly army is present?
    (as far as I remember the warcard Fortress mentioned 1 unit of Irregulars,
    and the Rulebook 1 unit of Infantery).
    Still the cost is less expensive than the PS of Endier mentions (1 GB per
    level). Why not raise the cost to a full GB per level (less math with parts
    of GB) and include the garrison unit again?
    bye
    Michael Romes

    ************************************************** **************************
    The Birthright Homepage: http://www.birthright.net
    Birthright-l Archives: http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/birthright-l.html
    To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM
    with UNSUB BIRTHRIGHT-L in the body of the message.

  2. #2
    Senior Member blitzmacher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    el paso
    Posts
    250
    Downloads
    24
    Uploads
    0
    Why not have Fortification cost at 1GB every 2 levels, easier math then 2/3GB per level, and not as expensive as 1GB per level?
    Cattle die and kinsmen die,
    thyself too soon must die,
    but one thing never, I ween, will die, --
    fair fame of one who has earned.
    HAVAMAL

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Fairborn Ohio, USA
    Posts
    108
    Downloads
    4
    Uploads
    0
    Pikeman are designed to take out mounted cavalry. So against charging units the pikemens reach get a chance to damage their charging attacker at the same time -and do double damage]. Its just not wise for mounted units set up against a charge.

    Example: A unit of pikemen are charged by a unit of cavalry. Those attacks are resolved simultaneously. The pikemen hit and cause double damage since the cavalry was charging, the cavalry is destroyed. The cavalries attack miss. Bad luck.

    A second unit of cavalry sees this exchange and next turn moves into the pikemens square. Though they have movement left and can charge they choose not to. During the attack phase both attacks are resolved simultaneously during the resolution of the melee attack.

    The 2E defensive garrision has now been replaced with free attack by the fortifications level:Page 127Fortifcations Movement.

    Mike Spehar

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    883
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    spehar wrote:

    >This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
    > You can view the entire thread at: http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1305
    >spehar wrote:
    > Pikeman are designed to take out mounted cavalry. So against charging units the pikemens reach get a chance to damage their charging attacker at the same time -and do double damage]. Its just not wise for mounted units set up against a charge.
    >
    >Example: A unit of pikemen are charged by a unit of cavalry. Those attacks are resolved simultaneously. The pikemen hit and cause double damage since the cavalry was charging, the cavalry is destroyed.
    >
    This I fully understood.

    >A second unit of cavalry sees this exchange and next turn moves into the pikemens square. Though they have movement left and can charge they choose not to. During the attack phase both attacks are resolved simultaneously during the resolution of the melee attack.
    >
    This I don´t understand: When the cavalry does not charge it attacks
    with it´s melee attack in the Melee phase. The Pikemen attack during the
    Charge Phase according to the sentence in the Charge phase description,
    so as far as I understand they do not attack at the same time, but the
    Pikeman attack first and the Cavalry could be hit before it attacks back.

    Or is the sentence "for the first round of engagement only" meant that
    Pikemen can only attack in the Charge phase the first time in a battle
    and never again for the rest of the battle? I understood that they
    attack in the Charge Phase, due to their reach weapons every time they
    engage a new enemy.

    Or even other: Do Pikemen only attack in the Charge Phase if they are
    charged? That sounds strange - either they have reach weapons and attack
    in that phase due to their reach or not.

    >The 2E defensive garrision has now been replaced with free attack by the fortifications level:Page 127Fortifcations Movement.
    >
    That means an attacking unit has to endure the free missile attack and
    then can try to take the fortress as no defending unit is present to
    prevent this? The opposed Warcraft check to be made when trying to enter
    the fortified area: Does the attack have to succeed such a check, too
    when no defender is present - or can he simply take the fortress after
    enduring the free missile attack?
    bye
    Michael Romes

    ************************************************** **************************
    The Birthright Homepage: http://www.birthright.net
    Birthright-l Archives: http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/birthright-l.html
    To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM
    with UNSUB BIRTHRIGHT-L in the body of the message.

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Fairborn Ohio, USA
    Posts
    108
    Downloads
    4
    Uploads
    0
    I mispoke a little on the pikemen, lets see if i can clear that up. Pikemen attack during the charge phase during the 1st round of any engagment. On any second round of a continuous engagement they attack during the melee phase.

    Enemy units entering a square held by a castle gets a FREE missile attack by the castle defenses. Then the opposed warcraft checks have to be made. If the attacker fails they go back to the square they came from. If your unit doesn't get eliminated from the field by the free missile fire, and if you make the warcraft role to successfully storm the castle, if no defending unit is there the attacking unit now controls the square. Even if there is no defending unit, the warcraft check still has to be made.

    That help?

    Mike Spehar

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    883
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    spehar wrote:

    >This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
    > You can view the entire thread at: http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1305
    >
    > spehar wrote:
    > I mispoke a little on the pikemen, lets see if i can clear that up. Pikemen attack during the charge phase during the 1st round of any engagment. On any second round of a continuous engagement they attack during the melee phase.
    >
    And an engagement is a single fight with an enemy unit, meaning they
    attack in the Charge phase everytime they face a new enemy on the
    battlefield? Or only when the enemy move into their battlefield square
    and they attack in THAT round - and when they in that round still fight
    another enemy the 2nd one is in melee range?

    In your example with 2 cavalry units the first Cavalry charged and
    exchanged blows with the Pikeman in the Charge phase (unwise of the
    Cavalry) and the 2nd Cavalry exchanged blows in the Melee phase - that
    indicates that the Pikeman only can attack in the Charge Phase the first
    time an enemy enters their battlefieldsquare, not the first round of any
    engagement.

    So equally what unit attacks the Pikeman, in the first round of
    engagement the Pikeman attack in the Charge phase, which means that even
    Elite Infantery can be hit BEFORE it can attack the Pikeman, regardless
    of its bonus against Pikeman?

    Free missile attack in Fortress is now clear, thanks.
    bye
    Michael Romes

    ************************************************** **************************
    The Birthright Homepage: http://www.birthright.net
    Birthright-l Archives: http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/birthright-l.html
    To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM
    with UNSUB BIRTHRIGHT-L in the body of the message.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Fairborn Ohio, USA
    Posts
    108
    Downloads
    4
    Uploads
    0
    Pikemen attack during the charge phase everytime they engage a new opponent during the 1st round of that engagment only. Even against Elite infantry who get a bonus to hit pikemen. Sorry abotu mispeaking before.

    Mike Spehar

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
BIRTHRIGHT, DUNGEONS & DRAGONS, D&D, the BIRTHRIGHT logo, and the D&D logo are trademarks owned by Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and are used by permission. ©2002-2010 Wizards of the Coast, Inc.