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  1. #1
    Daniel McSorley
    Guest

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    >1. Establishing a level 1 holding:
    >
    >Is there any way to 'encroach' on another ruler's territory, without using
    >the aggravate action (twice, I think?), thus destroying ALL of their

    Well, it's always aggravated me, but the action is actually agitate.
    And no, I don't believe there is and existing mechanic for reducing a
    holding by only one level.
    >3. Introducing blooded characters to a domain
    >
    >I have read a lot of recent posts where DM's have said that they let their
    >players adventure and then introduced them to regency after they get to
    >level 4 or so. How do the characters become regents, other than being
    >simply next in line for the throne? How is this handled when you (intend)
    >have multiple PC's as regents (ie. do they all suddenly get appointed?)?
    >
    They could, in no particular order:
    - -overthrow the ruler
    - -be designated the heir
    - -create a new domain, it only costs GB not RP
    - -be made the new rulers of a conquored land by the conquorer, ie Avanil
    conquors Tuornen, they were loyal suppporters of his effort, he rewards them
    with some or all the provinces he conquored, as his vassals of course.
    It's late, so I can't think of any others. I'm sure everybody will get
    the ones I missed.

    Daniel McSorley
    mcsorley.1@osu.edu

  2. #2
    c558382@showme.missouri.
    Guest

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Simon Graindorge wrote:

    > 1. Establishing a level 1 holding:
    >
    > Is there any way to 'encroach' on another ruler's territory, without
    > [. . .] destroying ALL of their holdings? [. . .] It seems strange to me
    > that there is no way (unless I have misread the rules) to reduce
    > somebody's holding level (by one) so that you could establish a level 1
    > holding. I agree that it should be difficult to do, and obviously the
    > larger the existing holding level the more difficult it will be. Any
    > comments are (very) much appreciated.
    >

    I too have had some problem with the all or nothing character of the
    contest action. Power is gradually whittled away by one side or another.
    Second, nature abhores a vacume. There should never be a time where
    holdings are vacant. Holdings might be held by smaller figures in the
    collapse of greater power, but networks don'y dissolve, they *devolve*
    unto more local authorities. Clearly the collapse of the Carolingian
    Empire demonstrate how holdings lost to the center (the successors of
    Charlemagne) were not simply empty, but rather immediatly assumed by local
    lords. The same thing happened after the battle of Mohacs (1526) in which
    Hungary was partitioned. In BR terms, the regent died with no presumed
    heir, his regency was lost, and his holdings up for grabs. There was no
    viable heir recognized by the Hungarian nobility to assume the crown in
    Louis' place. What happened was the local nobles assumed the law holdings
    and collected regency in penny-packets. Three central entities began
    immediatly attracting these nobles to them: the victorious Turks who had
    won the battle of Mohacs, Ferdinand of Habsburg, and John Zapolya the
    viovode of Transylvania. Christian Hungarians were not siding with the
    Turk, but where the Turks had control (the middle third of the country)
    they could establish holdings and build them up. John Zapolya, as viovode
    of Transylvania, was an important Hungarian noble. He was therefore the
    national candidate for those nobles who did not wish to support either the
    Turks or the Habsburgs, but held out for a Hungarian king rather than
    incorporation in a larger empire. Zapolya's father in law was also king
    of Poland, and thus able to loan him GB and RP. Ferdinand's grandfather,
    the Emperor Maximilian, had conducted another of his famous marraige
    alliances with Hungary-Bohemia before his death (it was Max's marriages
    that gave Charles V his great empire). Ferdinand married the Hungarian
    princess Anne Jagellon, while his sister Mary (Habsburg) married Louis II
    Jagellon, king of Hungary and Bohemia. With Louis' death, his widowed
    queen, Mary, and his sister, Anne, became advocates of Ferdinand's
    candidacy. Getting GB and RP from his brother Charles V, Holy Roman
    Emperor and King of Spain. What happened is a shift, back and forth
    between Ferdinand and Zapolya. While many law holdings were not held by
    either Ferdinand or Zapolya, they were not absent, but held by local
    nobles. At various times, after this battle, or that bribe, or such and
    such a pronouncement by prominant bishops, holdings drifted back and
    forth.

    Rather than the all or nothing character of the present contest system.
    Contest actions should be for one holding at at time.

    It should still be possible to use the contest action to neutralize a
    group of holdings as per p. 52 of the rulebook, but should cost 2RP and
    1GB per level of the holding suspended. This would represent pogroms
    against enemies of the crown. If the people hated the attacked regent,
    this would be the only cost. But, if the people were merely indifferent
    to them, it should also drop a level of loyalty in the province.

    Kenneth Gauck
    c558382@showme.missouri.edu

  3. #3
    Samuel Weiss
    Guest

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    Agitate instead of aggravate, yes. But the action to destory anothers
    holding is Contest. Once to neutralize it and make it unusable until ruled
    by the owner. A second time to destroy it. Although oddly enough, instead
    of destroying it you could technically have a priest invest you with the
    holding. It would probably cost a heck of a lot of regency, but you would
    get the holding aaat full strength. This is something I have wondered about
    and would like to see cleared up.

    Samwise

  4. #4
    Neil Barnes
    Guest

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Daniel McSorley wrote:
    > >I have read a lot of recent posts where DM's have said that they let their
    > >players adventure and then introduced them to regency after they get to
    > >level 4 or so. How do the characters become regents, other than being
    > >simply next in line for the throne? How is this handled when you (intend)
    > >have multiple PC's as regents (ie. do they all suddenly get appointed?)?
    >
    > They could, in no particular order:
    > -overthrow the ruler
    > -be designated the heir

    "You have a strawberry birthmark in the shape of text reading 'I am the
    long lost heir to the throne of Aftane' - this means that you are the
    missing Jarl of Halskapa. Congratulations"

    neil

  5. #5
    Herald Williams
    Guest

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    At 10:25 AM 1/15/98 -0500, you wrote:
    >Agitate instead of aggravate, yes. But the action to destory anothers
    >holding is Contest. Once to neutralize it and make it unusable until ruled
    >by the owner. A second time to destroy it. Although oddly enough, instead
    >of destroying it you could technically have a priest invest you with the
    >holding. It would probably cost a heck of a lot of regency, but you would
    >get the holding aaat full strength. This is something I have wondered about
    >and would like to see cleared up.
    >
    >Samwise

    In the campaign I ran in early 1996, I decided that the regent doing a
    contest action could choose to contest just a particular number of levels.
    For example, if one regent had a law(4) and another regent wanted to
    contest, rather than contesting the whole law(4), he could contest just
    one (or two or three) levels. The cost was not reduced for doing this
    though and the "victim" regent's full holding was still counted in his
    favor for affecting the "attacker's" die roll.

  6. #6

    Congratulations and a few Quest

    In a message dated 98-01-14 23:31:03 EST, you write:

    >
    Well, this type of introduction of characters to regents is my favorite
    method, and I've done it twice now, so I'll offer my two cents.
    I like having the characters start out as "regular" adventurers and working
    into the realm game for a few reasons. I think that players that have their
    characters start out as regular adventurers and then "graduate" into regents
    feel a better connection to the area that they now are responsable for. I also
    think that the new regents feel more connected to their domains because they
    worked for them and had to prove themselves ready and able to rule. Also, the
    regular adventuring days gives the characters plenty of time to make
    connections with the "little people" of the champaign area.
    Ok, those were the reasons, now for the "how to" suggestions. I would advise
    you to first take a look at the domain areas that the players want to rule in.
    Look at who rules the area and what their motivations for and commitment to
    ruling are. Is the regent that you hope to replace with a pc the "reluctant
    ruler" who would gladly hand over rule to someone who was capable? Is the
    current regent an evil dictator that just seems to be begging to be
    overthrown? Is she an aged but beloved ruler who is looking for her next heir?
    you get the idea. Look at the present regent and determine what would be the
    best way for him or her to step down. And remember that the present ruler is
    probably not going to hand over the regency to someone who isn't "proven" to
    be a good prospect (or, in the case of a dictator, the PEOPLE won't support
    someone who hasn't proven themselves NOT to be another dictator wanna be).
    Once you know what the circumstances are that will lead to the replacement of
    the present regent, place the pc in the position to be the regent's (or the
    people's) choice of heir. Gear the first few adventurers so that the pcs come
    to the attention of the present regent and the people. Make the pcs popular
    (or even infamous) with the people in power and the commoners through the
    first few adventures. Play up the "local hero" bit so that when the pc gets
    handed the regency it seems logical.
    Those first few adventures are also a great time for the pcs to meet the
    other powerful people in the area as relativly unthreatening non-regents, and
    the players can use these times to pick up helpful info if they pay attention.
    Ok, done rambling.... Hope that made some sense. Simon, if you want the
    exact details of how I did it in my campaign, just e-mail me and I'll be glad
    ta help.
    Blastin

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