View Poll Results: Should the Emerald Spiral, as the name suggests, have a pine symbol?

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  • Yes, Pine for the Spiral

    2 66.67%
  • No, keep Erik with Oak

    1 33.33%
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Thread: Emerald Spiral

  1. #1
    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Emerald Spire

    Discussion thread for Emerald Spire. If you would like to add a comment, click the Post Reply button.

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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    heraldry

    Given the history of the name for this Church, wouldn't their "heraldry" use Erik-as-a-pine in preference to Erik-as-an-oak? I imagine that both symbols would be used within the church for Erik, but the church itself would use the pine one to represent itself.

    And I am not sure what Old Father of the Forests would use given its name? An oaken Green Man like the pagan symbol? Maybe with something different like acorns for eyes or pine leaves for hair. I guess that given the Brecht location, perhaps something more local may be appropriate. Fruit elements in the hair perhaps? Or maybe that doesn't work given the protective nature of the OFF church.

    Sorontar.

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    The gold background with the oak tree proper is the image from the rulebook. Being the oldest temple, they got the rulebook symbol. The Oaken Grove got the same image differenced, Green field, yellow tree.

    Oaks are frequently mentioned as sacred to Erik, I don't recall anything about pines. Also, the ES certainly had more holdings further south, once upon a time, and have migrated north with the population as they have also been displaced in the south by the new lifeways and the Oaken Grove.

    That was my reasoning, anyway.

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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Well, the reasoning behind the Emerald Spire's name is straight from the Book of Priestcraft.

    To quote in full:

    Erik‘s avatar takes on numerous forms. He often appears as a bare-chested, strong warrior with an iron gray beard and wild mane of hair, dressed in a great kilt of multiple shades of green on black. He is usually armed with a great axe and spear. Another favoured form is that of an old man with a green, mossy beard and wood-bark skin. The Emerald Spiral, one of the principal druidic organizations devoted to the worship of Erik, is said to take its name from one of his avatar forms. In this form, he appears as a majestic, towering pine rising out of a rocky tor.

    Sorontar.

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    BoP lists Oak tree as a symbol of Erik, and nothing else.

    So in terms of symbols, I would say Oak has it over Pine.

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    Senior Member Mojczak's Avatar
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    Well, for the added detail I'd say too that it would be nice if they had pine. I mean, why not? The info is there too. Not such a big woops. Different church, different dogmas. "my pine's bigger than your oak".

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    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    I've added a poll on this subject.

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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    I see the Oak and the Pine being used for different purposes.

    Erik is portrayed primarily as the Oak and that is what holy places are often based around.

    The Emerald Spire is uses the Oak for Erik and the Pine for the church/sect.

    The Oaken Grove uses the Oak in a variety of forms as Erik and the sect. Perhaps one for Erik and three for the Grove.

    The Old Father of the Forests prefers to use the Green Man for both, but also uses the Oak for Erik.

    Simple divisions between god/faith and church.

    Sorontar.

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    Senior Member Mojczak's Avatar
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    Well, it's named Emerald Spiral, should see for the typo too.

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    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Quite true... probably my fault, because I always remembered it as the Emerald Spire (as it in a "majestic, towering pine"), not a xmas tree with tinsel around it (i.e. the Emerald Spiral).

    The Grove of trees versus a Spiral of trees... I don't think the second ever gets mentioned, so I must take it that the Spiral is more symbolic of the Life Death Renewal circle. But then that doesn't match what the Book of Priestcraft says as it seems to care more about the type of tree and its grand form. I notice that the PS Hogunmark spells it the same way, so one of us will have to fix it on the BRwiki.

    Mighty confusing...

    Sorontar

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