Lycanthropy and blood?

[Lee]

One of the things I've always liked about BR and Cerilia was the limit on monsters that appear here, brand-new things don't just pop out of thin air when the DM buys a new book (and yes, I had this idea back in 2nd ed., too). The flip side of that, is when the DM sees a shiny new critter, he can slip in one as an awnshegh.

Currently, I'm musing about lycanthropes, seawolves in particular. Since the curse is magical in nature, and we know that scions are a bit magical in nature, has anyone thought about lycanthropy being a scion-only curse? I suppose the same would go for vampirism, too.

[RaspK_FOG]

You are making assumptions here: vampires are undead, lycanthropes have a supernatural disease; neither has anything to do with the whole "scion" thing, nor is there any allusion to that effect, and I don't think either are "new critters" on Cerilia - if anything, they might just be rare. :/

[Lee]

In a message dated 7/10/2007 11:23:29 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
brnetboard@BIRTHRIGHT.NET writes:

RaspK_FOG wrote:
You are making assumptions here: vampires are undead, lycanthropes have a
supernatural disease; neither has anything to do with the whole "scion" thing,
nor is there any allusion to that effect, and I don`t think either are "new
critters" on Cerilia - if anything, they might just be rare. :/



No, I apparently explained myself poorly. There are no allusions, but there
are no denials, either. I was suggesting that maybe lycanthropy is a
supernatural disease that *could be* blood-linked, or perhaps more powerful in
scions.

As for vampirism, has anyone dealt with the possibility of more than one
vampire, or is there just the one? If there are others, what happens when
they drain a scion-- do they become blooded? If so, there ought to be
evidence of this. I`m inclined to state, IMC, that there is only the one.

Lee.



************************************** See what`s free at http://www.aol.com.

[ShadowMoon]

Well, You could say that only blooded characters can be True Lycanthropes, others can only be Afflicted Lycanthropes...

And in regard of Vampires, well You can say that they retain any blood abilities if any, but bloodline strength drops with time, and when they drink blood of a Scion they can boost their bloodline potential or even use blood powers of their victims like their own...

[Dcolby]

This from the wiki and the 3.5 rules adaption. Specificly it refers to the "Beastmen" of Aduria, but at the tail end it mentions this about Lycanthropes.

"Many believe that the curse of lycanthropy is also one of Azrai's legacies to mankind; a dark gift intended to strengthen the ranks of his followers."

It appears that perhaps Lycanthropy predates the blooding from the gods sacrificing themselves. At least imho. :)

[AndrewTall]

One other way about introducing vampires/lycanthropes is to have the Vampire occasionally create minor vampires, a Were-wolf awnshegh create lycanthropes etc just as the gorgon and hydra makes lesser versions of themselves.

Offspring, surviving victims, either works...

It's a good way of having small clumps of monsters, although you can have a 'lesser' vampire who fled as far from his master as possible if you want one somewhere else...

[kgauck]

Or who is on a mission of some kind, even if its just to harvest bloodlines or cause mayhem. But more sinister plans are good too (especially for minions of the Vampire) such as recovering lost items of power, setting up holdings, pitting two realms against one another, driving a relam into chaos, or serving some other malevolent purpose.

[Satchkep45]

This is a topic I've been pondering myself of late. I'm in the process of expanding and converting to 3E BR the Ravenloft domain of Vorostokov and there the domain lord is a werewolf (lupe de noir) who controls many of his lycanthropic subjects.

I thought that this would be a neat bloodline ability, though I have yet to work out exactly how its done. Has anyone created a lycanthrope bloodline ability? I would love to take a look at the ideas if so.

[geeman]

At 08:15 PM 7/10/2007, Satchkep45 wrote:

>Has anyone created a lycanthrope bloodline ability? I would love to
>take a look at the ideas if so.

I haven`t created a lycanthrope blood ability per se, but I have
something that kinda sorta might work for this purpose.

Before I get to it, though, I should note that there are a few
interesting relationships between certain things like lycanthopy,
vampirism and bloodline: namely blood. There`s nothing I can think
of that would indicate a scion`s divine blood should protect him from
either the "disease" or the "curse" (if you will) and, in fact, I
could make a pretty good argument that scions would be more
vulnerable than commoners. After all, isn`t their blood by nature
more "absorbent" than a typical mortal? Given the supernatural
aspects of both the disease and the curse, the transformative effects
of awn/ersheghlien changes, and that the blood of scions might be
more attractive to those inclined to feed on them it seems like
scions are apt if not vulnerable. One could argue that the divine
blood protects the scion from such trivialities as diseases and
curses (albeit supernatural ones) but its just as easy to see it the other way.

That said, a lycanthrope blood ability should take one very important
thing into account: awn-/ersheghlien are not typical, D&D
representatives of their namesake. THE Vampire is not A vampire in
the normal D&D game mechanical sense. Nor is he, in fact, really a
vampire in the way that vampires are undead. Death generally ends
bloodline. The Vampire is a vampire-like human whose transformation
into a thematically similar totemic monster is facilitated by his
divine heritage. He`s certainly more similar to a vampire than, say,
Rogr Aglondier, but the differences between the Vampire and one
actually cursed with vampirism are significant in both kith and
kind. My point is that a scion who became THE Werewolf would not be
a werewolf in the same sense that the Vampire isn`t a vampire, the
Gorgon isn`t a gorgon and the Spider isn`t a spider.

So. If I were to make The Werewolf as an awnshegh (and I did once,
as a matter fact--it was the first PC that anyone playtested with the
awn-/ershegh character class) what I would do is generate his
transformation into a man-wolf using standardized rules. Then I
would apply the following sequence of abilities to him:

Unshegh 1: You are able to temporarily shrug off the effects of your
awnshegh transformation, returning to your unaltered base
form. Taking on your base form requires a full round action and a
successful Will save (DC 10 + awnshegh level.) You remain in your
non-transformed shape for 1 minute per wisdom point. While in your
base form you retain your hp, BAB and saves from levels taken in the
awnshegh character class, but lose any effects from transformations,
disadvantages and bonus BP. You may voluntarily return to your
"normal" awnshegh form at any time, but the change requires a full
round action. Returning to your awnshegh form at the end of the
transformation`s duration also is a full round action.

Unshegh 2: You get a +5 bonus to your Will save to return to human
form, and the effects of a successful will save is increased to ten
minutes per wisdom point.

Unshegh 3: You get an additional +5 bonus to your will save and
increases the time that you remain in your base form to 1 hour per
wisdom point.

Unshegh 4+: Taking the Unshegh transformation a fourth time (or more)
continues to give you +5 on your will save, but does not increase the
time that you remain in your base form.

Unshegh 5+: Your transformation between your awnshegh form and base
form becomes a free action.

I use a character class to portray awn-/ersheghlien transformation,
so a few of the things in there might need to change (particularly
the way to compute the saving throw DC) if you are going to use another system.

Using such a system, The Werewolf becomes an awnshegh who can
temporarily take on his mortal form rather than an werewolf whose
disease determines the nature of his change. The character would
likely have a set of werewolf-like disadvantages and advantages
(vulnerability to silver, a bite, damage resistence, etc.)

The thematic point being that it might be possible for an awnshegh`s
transformation to be temporarily shrugged off, but where The Werewolf
is a man-beast who can temporarily take human form a werewolf is a
human who can take on a bestial one.

Hope that helps,
Gary

[Gman]

I would be curious to see if anyone has some thoughts on what would happen if a awnshegh swallowed a blooded scion whole... Lets say the Leviathan chomps someone whole ... etc.

I think that they would probably be entitled to a pretty high blood transfer. -
Or if a Blooded/awnshegh Wampire drained a blooded scion dry.

[geeman]

At 09:44 PM 7/17/2007, Gman wrote:

>I would be curious to see if anyone has some thoughts on what would
>happen if a awnshegh swallowed a blooded scion whole... Lets say the
>Leviathan chomps someone whole ... etc.
>
>I think that they would probably be entitled to a pretty high blood
>transfer. -
>
>Or if a Blooded/awnshegh Wampire drained a blooded scion dry.

I don`t think simply swallowing a scion whole would necessitate a lot
of transfer--or any at all, really. This kind of thing might depend
on the circumstances involved, of course, and DM fiat can be pretty
broad, but the fundamental concept involved in bloodtheft is
_supposed_ to be that the scion`s heart is pierced. Unless he`s
actually impaled by teeth, a scion who was swallowed whole would,
probably, die of crushing injuries, suffocation, chronic halitosis or
something along those lines, all of which would leave behind a
bruised, smooshed and unbeating heart--but one that remains more or
less unpierced. If a scion dies with his heart unpierced then his
bloodline "dies" with him (or is passed on to his heir.) At the
moment of death the scion`s heart becomes so much muscle and
plasma. A creature that gobbled down a scion whole would, therefore,
not perform bloodtheft when that scion`s heart was eventually damaged
(read: "digested") after the scion himself had died by other,
non-heart-piercing actions.

There are a few things to indicate that the blood itself plays some
sort of role in bloodine and bloodtheft, and a couple of existing
awnshegh who appear to perform acts of bloodtheft that involve the
blood itself, so one could find some sort of rationale for allowing a
transfer then, but since those cases are so limited they can be
handled on a case-by-case basis.

Gary

[AndrewTall]

I would be curious to see if anyone has some thoughts on what would happen if a awnshegh swallowed a blooded scion whole... Lets say the Leviathan chomps someone whole ... etc.

I think that they would probably be entitled to a pretty high blood transfer. -
Or if a Blooded/awnshegh Wampire drained a blooded scion dry.

I think that often if the monster eats the scion the bloodtheft is treated as if tighmaevril was used - see the vampires blood-draining or the power gained by the Boar. I don't think there is a set rule though, and it may depend on whether the target is a scion of azrai who's bloodline often seems to want to be claimed by the consumer - so it can corrupt...

[Gman]

I realised that most of the awnsheghlien called vampires or werewolfs or whatever are called this because the unique powers they gained from The blood tend to make them resemble a mythological creature in some way.
Its not that they actually start as a vampire or a gorgon and get blood powers.

This does suggest an existing mythology and creatures in the histories but a more organic story - it looks like, it smells like so we call it one.