Q: Tarazin the Grey

[CBebris@aol.co]

>Could someone please enlighten me into what this Chronicle of Cerilia is ?

The Chronicle is an article Ed Stark and I wrote for Dragon Magazine #241. It
includes the most up-to-date official timeline in existence and some
legends/adventure nuggets.

For those of you who have copies--is it just me, or does one of the jousters
in the illustration have no arms???

Carrie Bebris

[DKEvermore@aol.co]

In a message dated 4/28/99 11:01:06 AM Central Daylight Time,
vander+@pitt.edu writes:

> A
> dragon should decimate province levels when it wakes, ravenous from a long
> sleep. It should be capable of destroying or routing whole army units on
> the field of battle. It should be capable of instilling fear into the
> heart of AWNSEGHLEIN, even the Gorgon and the Raven and the Serpent.
>
> Mark VanderMeulen
> vander+@pitt.edu

I agree, except that I'm not convinced the Gorgon would be afraid. According
to legend (and only legend--it might be different in your campaign), the
Gorgon destroyed a dragon at Kal-Saitharak and took its residence for his
own. With his magic and weapons, the Gorgon can go toe-to-toe with a dragon
and win every time.

The Raven has invulnerability. So although he can be defeated by a dragon
(supposedly because much of the Raven's magical power is tied to the Shadow
World), it's likely that he'd rise again.

The Serpent, I think, would make so much dragon food.

Just my thoughts,
Dustin K Evermore

[Mark A Vandermeulen]

On Wed, 28 Apr 1999 DKEvermore@aol.com wrote:

> I agree, except that I'm not convinced the Gorgon would be afraid. According
> to legend (and only legend--it might be different in your campaign), the
> Gorgon destroyed a dragon at Kal-Saitharak and took its residence for his
> own. With his magic and weapons, the Gorgon can go toe-to-toe with a dragon
> and win every time.

OK, I'll give you that the Gorgon might be able to stand his own against a
dragon and give as well as he gets. I don't think he might be expected to
win EVERY time, esp. if the dragon had time to prepair appropriately, as
opposed to being caught by surprize, which is what I imagine happened to
Kal-Saitharak. I DON'T think that the reason that there aren't many
dragons in Cerilia is because they're all scared of the Gorgon.

I've always thought that one of the keys to restoring the Anuirean Empire
(if that were to occur) is that the Restorer would have to have a dragon
who owes him a favor, to fall upon the Gorgon eventually when the time is
right. That's about all I figure would have a decent chance of taking care
of ole rock-butt.

Mark VanderMeulen
vander+@pitt.edu

[Cobos]

DKEvermore@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 4/28/99 11:01:06 AM Central Daylight Time,
> vander+@pitt.edu writes:
>
> > A
> > dragon should decimate province levels when it wakes, ravenous from a long
> > sleep. It should be capable of destroying or routing whole army units on
> > the field of battle. It should be capable of instilling fear into the
> > heart of AWNSEGHLEIN, even the Gorgon and the Raven and the Serpent.
> >
> > Mark VanderMeulen
> > vander+@pitt.edu
>
> I agree, except that I'm not convinced the Gorgon would be afraid. According
> to legend (and only legend--it might be different in your campaign), the
> Gorgon destroyed a dragon at Kal-Saitharak and took its residence for his
> own. With his magic and weapons, the Gorgon can go toe-to-toe with a dragon
> and win every time.
>
> The Raven has invulnerability. So although he can be defeated by a dragon
> (supposedly because much of the Raven's magical power is tied to the Shadow
> World), it's likely that he'd rise again.
>
> The Serpent, I think, would make so much dragon food.
>
> Just my thoughts,
> Dustin K Evermore
> ************************************************** *************************
> > In my campaign I've sort of hinted to the players that there are about only 6-7
dragons left in the entire continent, and I play them all as "at least" great
wyrm.
Not to mention that they will all have a high wizard level. After all they are
unique...
They would probably be more or less indestructible except by time...
I am looking forward to let the players discover the dragon in the Five Peaks
when they finally get as far north there... :)) mhuauuaua...

Sindre

[David Sean Brown]

Just had to look...and by gosh you're right...wierd or what!

Sean


> For those of you who have copies--is it just me, or does one of the jousters
> in the illustration have no arms???
>
> Carrie Bebris
> ************************************************** *************************
> > 'unsubscribe birthright' as the body of the message.
>

[Morg]

Mark A Vandermeulen wrote:

> OK, I'll give you that the Gorgon might be able to stand his own against a
> dragon and give as well as he gets. I don't think he might be expected to
> win EVERY time, esp. if the dragon had time to prepair appropriately, as
> opposed to being caught by surprize, which is what I imagine happened to
> Kal-Saitharak. I DON'T think that the reason that there aren't many
> dragons in Cerilia is because they're all scared of the Gorgon.

Say, this reminds me, does anyone know the status of the "Gorgon Crown' Secrets
book that was being built on 'Peter "The Dragon" Hodge's (I hope I got that
right... doin' it from memory) site is???

Of all regions in cerilia, I expected this one to be detailed a hundred times over
already....

I sure would like a peek.....

Morg

[DKEvermore@aol.co]

In a message dated 4/28/99 2:38:43 PM Central Daylight Time, vander+@pitt.edu
writes:

> OK, I'll give you that the Gorgon might be able to stand his own against a
> dragon and give as well as he gets. I don't think he might be expected to
> win EVERY time, esp. if the dragon had time to prepair appropriately, as
> opposed to being caught by surprize, which is what I imagine happened to
> Kal-Saitharak. I DON'T think that the reason that there aren't many
> dragons in Cerilia is because they're all scared of the Gorgon.
>
I never claimed dragons were afraid of the Gorgon. I specifically stated the
other way around. It would be rediculous to blame the low population of
dragons on the Gorgon's presence.

- -DKE

[DKEvermore@aol.co]

In a message dated 4/28/99 2:49:52 PM Central Daylight Time, cobos@saers.com
writes:

> They would probably be more or less indestructible except by time...
> I am looking forward to let the players discover the dragon in the Five
> Peaks
> when they finally get as far north there... :)) mhuauuaua...
>
> Sindre
>
The players in my campaign (Cwmb Bheinn centered) have decided to go and have
a word with Vore Lekiniskiy (Old Master Fireworm) because he built up a
source holding in a province of theirs. They conveniently ignored the fact
that the PCs only had a source 0 there and were therefore not using the magic
there.

The queen (PC) thought it might be a tad risky, though so she invested the
HEAD of the Gheallie Sidhe!! with control of the kingdom, just in case. The
Ghaellie commander (NPC) humbly suggested it--for the well-being of the
kingdom of course.

Man, I love it when the PCs gullibly take any suggestion from an NPC and
don't think it through. ]:>

- -DKE

[Ben]

I can wait for the crown if it means I get seneschal 2.0 sooner! Go
Pete!



- ----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Hodge
To:
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 1999 6:58 PM
Subject: RE: [BIRTHRIGHT] - Q: Tarazin the Grey


> I'll reply to this one :)
>
> The Gorgon's Crown project has indeed started but is slow going thanks to
> Seneschal 2.0 taking up every spare second I get :).
>
> Peter "Dragon" Hodge
> E-mail: dragon@uq.net.au
> Website: Dragon's Lair (
> www.uq.net.au/~zzphodge )
> ICQ: 2863795
>

[geeman]

Sindre Cools Berg wrote:

> In my campaign I've sort of hinted to the players that there are about only 6-7
> dragons left in the entire continent, and I play them all as "at least" great
> wyrm.
> Not to mention that they will all have a high wizard level. After all they are
> unique...
> They would probably be more or less indestructible except by time...
> I am looking forward to let the players discover the dragon in the Five Peaks
> when they finally get as far north there... :)) mhuauuaua...

Interesting.

Another thing to remember is that, though there are only a few dragons on Cerilia,
it is a rather small continent, and one that is not too far from other significant
land masses. Just us other creatures migrate, so might dragons. A fiery beast
might intrude from Aduria, an icy one from beyond the Thaelasian....

To give my own answers to the questions I posed:

#1: I think the biological reason there are fewer dragons is that dragons
themselves are a dying race. (At least, the Cerilian versions are.) They breed so
seldom and take so long to reach the age of maturation that they just can't compete
in a biological way with other creatures that are more successful like elves,
dwarves, goblins and (most significantly) with humans. The decline of the elves is
often attributed to incursions by humans. Why not the same influence on dragons?
This need not be the kind of direct competition that most people imagine in fantasy
games, but the more day-to-day kind of competition for resources, land, food, etc.
that is the true pattern of migratory influences we so often like to ignore.

#2: I think from a thematic standpoint, dragons are rather superfolous in BR. I
mean, we already have people running around with the blood of the gods in them.
Those spawn of Azrai can become awnsheghlien, which are essentially iconic
monsters; THE Serpent, THE Gorgon, THE Raven. Dragons are usually the biggest,
meanest opponents available. Having a lot of them in BR would lessen the
significance of the awnsheghlien and hence the setting itself.

It would also conflict with the "low-level" character of the game. In BR, just
about anyone coule become a regent. 1st level characters can have thousands, even
hundreds of thousands of people under their authority. That's all well and good,
but toss a dragon at them and good King Nobody the First will by wyrm food before
he can scream "Guards!" Dragons and low-level campaigns don't mix. They must,
therefore, become aloof, rare and distant. So powerful that they are godlike both
in power and in attitude.

Gary

[WILLELA@aol.co]

On the possibility of a war between dragon & giants being the cause of our
shortage of dragons in Birthright, Mark Vandermuelen [Vander+@pitt.edu(Mark A
Vandermulen)] refers us to a "significant part of 'King of the Giantdowns' ."
The reference is to a war between giants, with an incidental mention that
dragons were involved.
Yours for deeper dungeons
David Argall

[Mark A Vandermeulen]

On Thu, 29 Apr 1999 WILLELA@aol.com wrote:

> On the possibility of a war between dragon & giants being the cause of our
> shortage of dragons in Birthright, Mark Vandermuelen [Vander+@pitt.edu(Mark A
> Vandermulen)] refers us to a "significant part of 'King of the Giantdowns' ."
> The reference is to a war between giants, with an incidental mention that
> dragons were involved.

Well, I never claimed a perfect memory. :)

Still could have had a nasty effect on dragon population sizes, though. I
wonder how dragons got to be involved in a war between giants in the first
place? Was it a political battle, and various giants called in favors that
certain dragons had owed them? Was it a massive good-vs.-evil clash in
which certain dragons became embroiled supporting their favorate causes?
And where were the elves at this point? Had they not arrived/been
created/evolved yet at this point? Were they the servants of the giants
and survived where their masters fell? Where they only involved
peripherally in the conflict, not yet having fully developed as a
civilization, having at most a somewhat feral arboreal tribal culture?
Anyone have any ideas or opinions? I know some people have developed whole
pantheonic histories of the old gods and their relationships; how did you
incorporate this giantwar stuff?

Mark VanderMeulen
vander+@pitt.edu

[the Falcon]

> Man, I love it when the PCs gullibly take any suggestion from an NPC and
> don't think it through. ]:>

Your PCs do that kinda stuff? Man, IMC they don't even trust the NPCs
they _should_ trust...

[DKEvermore@aol.co]

In a message dated 5/3/99 4:53:55 AM Central Daylight Time,
m.m.richert@twi.tudelft.nl writes:

> Your PCs do that kinda stuff? Man, IMC they don't even trust the NPCs
> they _should_ trust...
>
What can I say? I have an honest face. hehehehe.
- -Dustin Evermore