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  1. #11
    Senior Member Arentak's Avatar
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    I suppose its fair to say a regent should know the names of the holding owners in adjacent provinces, and the holding owners and levels of holdings in his own provinces.

    So, Queen Liliene Swordwraith of Aerenwe would know that ETN has a temple 6 in Calrie, and would know that IHH has a presence in Bellam. It might even be fair, if you were willing to get complicated, that a regent might know holding levels of their own type of holding in adjacent (only) provinces. So, while Queen Liliene would know IHH has a temple in Bellam, she might also know that MR has a Law 1 in Bellam.

    Its all about the DM.

    In an online game, it gets more complex then with 4 or 5 friends playing at a table.
    I like PBEM's.

  2. #12
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    I guess the most realistic way would be to allow everyone to know all holding owners everywhere as they are at the beginning of the game. Then, when new holdings are created or old ones destroyed, the DM would judge how fast and how far the new spreads with travellers and merchants. Of course, this is easier to accomplish in an online games where the pace is rather slow. It's not so feasible in a tabletop game where fast responses are required from the DM.

  3. #13
    Well, when the Birthright Campaign Setting first came out, I remember that there was a lot of discussion about the nature of "regency" -- what it represents and how it is accumulated. The best comparison that, I think, I have ever been able to make is the Ancient Roman concept of auctoritas. See the following link:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auctoritas

    I've always thought of regency accumulated being a form of auctoritas -- with the regency cap imposed by one's bloodline score being a form of dignitas. See the following link:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dignitas_(Roman_concept)

    The discussion, I remember, going on when the setting came out centered around guild holdings in particular -- the idea being that, given the nature of regency, it was difficult to explain how guild holdings accumulated regency when a simple financial transaction really shouldn't generate that degree of influence. There were some counterarguments (which I thought were fairly weak) revolving around customer trust and brand loyalty.

    However, I never really thought that those modern concepts really fit into the Birthright setting -- which is why I've always gravitated more toward the idea the guild holdings probably can be best explained as representing the medieval political institutions that evolved in cities and towns. Firth guilds and merchant guilds gradually giving way to civil governments and eventually giving way to leagues of towns . . . . That's never been really popular in the Birthright community because a lot of people think it's too modern and it's not "feudal" enough for the setting. However, I think there isn't much understanding that, in medieval times, there were really two parallel social structures -- the traditional feudal agricultural system and the civil/guild structure which evolved in cities and towns, which kings/regents actually supported (again, contrary to what most people think) as a counterbalance to fickle nobles because it was a more secure base of power for the kings/regents that allowed them to start building standing armies.

    Anyway . . . . That discussion all aside, I think that all holdings really have to be public (including sources). If you accept the fact that regency generated by holdings is a form of auctoritas, then in order for that regency to be accumulated people have to be able to pin it to a specific figure. If they can't do that, then it can't really accumulate.

    That would be my two cents . . . . I'll see what people's reactions are to these thoughts.

    (Edited out some typos.)
    Last edited by Nicholas Harrison; 11-03-2011 at 11:29 AM.

  4. #14
    Site Moderator AndrewTall's Avatar
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    I like the auctoritas approach, but would blend it with a Feng Shui approach of the world bending partly around the will - conscious or not - of the regent to reflect the scion vs non-scion ruler split and allow those blessed with powerful fragemnts of godhood to be successful beyond the norm consistently without being totally unbelievable. So a regent with a high bloodline who really wants something to happen will in effect find their localised part of the universe favouring their actions to some degree, the people who look to them will lean towards favouring their views, etc and so routinely be far more succesful than someone equally smart, hard-working, etc but without a bloodline.

    Either way I agree that there needs to be a focal point/person who is the recipient of the respect/worship/etc. This person could as easily be a pious monk who dispenses daily wisdom as readily as some grandee with legal titles, they just need to be someone that other people look to for guidance, etc. The details of what the GB, structure, etc that spread their power or their actions are then pure flavour for me.

    I note that you can still have a hidden ruler and keep a larger domain intact by means of the vassalage rules. So the White Witch can be active in Rjurik without national hysteria because everyone locally thinks that the head of the holding is the respected and honoured warcaptain Bjorn Redbeard, Bjorn in turn follows the wise advice of his aaolfer advisers 'from the north', without any idea that in practice he is serving the awnshegh. That sort of approach would of course constrain the actions carried out by the local holding, make discovery of the secret chain of advisers cause havoc, and therefore allow a small band of cunning doughty adventurers to make a major difference in the region without wholescale slaughter - a novel concept but one which intrigues me.

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