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  1. #11
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    On Sat, 2002-05-18 at 16:29, John Machin wrote:
    > > Again yes I agree. Although with a little imaginative use the
    > > war card rules are adequate to the task. (Not that DBM isn`t
    > > a good system - I`m an old wargamer from way back, but the
    > > cards are not as woeful as suggested - preferences and
    > > prejudices aside.) Allowing a province to be fortified
    > > (defended) by traps etc, will allow the Spider`s forces to
    > > avoid actual battle on any but their own terms - while the
    > > fortification plus the actual terrain hinder the formations
    > > of the Anuireans.
    >
    > Sorry.
    > Under no circumstances can I permit the fiendish war-cards any
    > advantage.
    > As such I disagree.

    Spoken like a Crusader to a Waratah.



    >
    > --
    > John Machin
    > (trithemius@paradise.net.nz)
    > -----------------------------------
    > "Nothing is more beautiful than to know the All."
    > Athanasius Kircher, Ars Magna Sciendi.
    >
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  2. #12
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Gary" <geeman@SOFTHOME.NET>
    Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 4:17 AM


    > In general, I think the awnsheghlien should abide by most of the same
    rules
    > for controlling a domain that standard regents do. I

    I think they get much better fitting these exceptional realms into the rules
    set as they went along. Some of these early attempts to write up these
    awnsheghlien produce hapless realms in which there may be plenty of
    description of how powerful the realms are, with no backing in the realm
    level of play. Perhaps the goblins and spiders of the Spiderfell live in
    harmony with the sources, allowing full source capacity like the elves, but
    as a 0-level province, its pretty weak.

    My take is that some of these early realms were just written up poorly.
    Blood enemies doesn`t help much either, at least as far as the Spider is
    concerned. It would seem that the official take on the Spider is that he`s
    just too tough to personally kill, since he`ll regenerate, and then what?
    Come after his usurper? He only has 10 RP and 20 GB, and has no real source
    for more of either.

    Some alteration is neccesary, or the small army described will be destroyed
    by adventuerers alone, and adventerer-rulers with realm spells and other
    goodies would have no trouble - as written. I think when the Spiderfell was
    written, they hadn`t fully realized the distinct nature of BR, because this
    reads like a high level adventure and nothing more.

    Kenneth Gauck
    kgauck@mchsi.com

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  3. #13
    Senior Member Trithemius's Avatar
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    Peter sez:
    > Spoken like a Crusader to a Waratah.

    That`d be sport.

    I don`t do sport.

    --
    John Machin
    (trithemius@paradise.net.nz)
    -----------------------------------
    "Nothing is more beautiful than to know the All."
    Athanasius Kircher, Ars Magna Sciendi.

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    John 'Trithemius' Machin
    The Other John From Dunedin (now in Canberra)
    "Power performs the Miracle." - Johannes Trithemius

  4. #14
    Senior Member Trithemius's Avatar
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    Kenneth sez:
    > Some alteration is neccesary, or the small army described
    > will be destroyed by adventuerers alone, and
    > adventerer-rulers with realm spells and other goodies would
    > have no trouble - as written. I think when the Spiderfell
    > was written, they hadn`t fully realized the distinct nature
    > of BR, because this reads like a high level adventure and
    > nothing more.

    And, why oh why, does some enterprising wizard not just `Ward` the whole
    place? There must be some reason that lies outside of the realm rules to
    explain the Spiderfell`s power.

    --
    John Machin
    (trithemius@paradise.net.nz)
    -----------------------------------
    "Nothing is more beautiful than to know the All."
    Athanasius Kircher, Ars Magna Sciendi.

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    John 'Trithemius' Machin
    The Other John From Dunedin (now in Canberra)
    "Power performs the Miracle." - Johannes Trithemius

  5. #15
    Administrator Green Knight's Avatar
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    Some suggestions for explaining the Spiderfell. Taken from my Ruins of Empire campaign.

    No major surveys have taken place in the SF, so who is to say anyting about population etc.?

    1) The Spiderfell is really 3 provinces (N,E, and W).
    2) Provinces are rated 2, 2, 3 (even goblins need province levels - a province (0) isn't full of goblins IMO).
    3) The Spider controls all holdings within and taxes severely. This generates a decent income.
    4) Source level is base 9 to account for the ancient, evil forest. This gives sourve levels of 7,7, and 6
    5) The wizard Caine controls the sources and has some kind of twisted deal with the Spider to guard the Fell (or it might be he's just protecting his three most poweful sources).
    6) The terrain does present problems for a would-be attacker. Cavalry and large battle formations is not the way to fight in the Fell. Skirmishes mostly, whcih favor the goblins and gnolls of the Fell.
    7) Spider attacks cause damage and reduces morale in attacking troops. The morale aspect should not be underestimated - the Fell has a BAD reputation.
    8) The Spider gets access te cheap goblin and gnoll troops.
    9) He can call levies of decent goblin/gnoll/spider troops.
    The ist goes on...

    Cheers
    Cheers
    Bjørn
    DM of Ruins of Empire II PbeM

  6. #16
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    I just thought that I would sit and write about the outcome of the PC regent attacking the Spiderfells with his large army. We are playing a 3E version of Birthright. I wanted a quick and efficient resolution of this, so based on all the great information that I got here from your posts, I developed this plan of resolution...

    First, any unit entering the Spiderfells uninvited was subject to the mantraps, pitfalls, poisonous spiders, quicksand and other traps left there by the inhabitants. So each unit was allowed a Reflex Save, DC 10, to survive the traps. I assumed that the average member of a unit would have a Ref Save of +1 and extrapolated that into the units save bonus. Save or die is harsh, but I thought it justified given the dangerous nature of the Spiderfells.

    Those units that survived could then face the Spider's minions on the 'field of combat' The Spider's standing levy of 10 units for self protection included:

    3 goblin irreg.
    2 goblin arch.
    2 goblin guards
    1 goblin infantry
    2 goblin spiderriders

    The effects of the forest and fortress terrain cards were also put into effect over the entire battlefield.

    If the PC regent decided to retreat with any units, they would again be subject to another save against all the traps when attempting to escape from the Spiderfells. If the Spider's army was defeated, the Spider itself would escape to some unknown place to plot revenge.

    At the end of the session that prompted me to post in the first place, The PC regent declared war late, at the end of the session when we were trying to decided if we could stay up any later. This lead to an hour long arguement/discussion about the rules and left things hazy as to whether or not his declaration of war was official or not. The other players recognized that this was big and really deserving of an epic adventure that involved all of the PCs. So they influenced the player to get him to forgo attacking the spider between sessions. Of course, they new I was posting here for advice. At the begining of the next session, the player used his scouts to determine the troop strength of the Spider's Forces in the Spiderfell and decided that he would probably not be successful, opting for a different action.

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