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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Knight View Post
    I would not immediately adopt this approach to hvy cav charges if I were you...it seems overly simplified and overly powerful. Seeing as you portray this as a renaissance type of game, then the heyday of the armored charge is over...replaced by missile power and disciplined infantry (very simplified)

    But that aside; read a few books on medieval warfare and you should do well adjudicating what works and whatnot on the battlefield. Even better, read a few books on the evolution of warfare into the renaissance era.
    It's actually not much more powerful than the default rules. Under normal BR rules, Knight units have a Melee of +6 and get +4 to Charge. They thus have a +10, giving them a very good chance to inflict a Hit. When they inflict a hit, they cause a morale check to be made or the unit routs.

    What I was proposing was to make that unit that sees these heavy armored tanks charging down on them make a morale check prior to contact. Note, the success DC is only a 10, so most of the time units will make it. However, when they don't, the soldiers are overcome by their natural tendency to try to do whatever the hell you can to get out of the way of the thousands of pounds of beast and metal going to trample them. It's a pretty tough instinct to fight. Routed units suffer a -4 penalty to all attack actions--meaning that many are scattering rather than trying to attack the knights. They could still hurt the knights, but most of them are too busy trying not to get skewered or trampled. Routed units can also make an attempt to regain cohesion every round. All that is standard rules.

    I was also suggesting that the Knights be able to inflict 2 hits on a charge, perhaps by automatically scoring a critical threat (which then must, as normal, be followed by a confirmation). Again, this is due to the sheer power of the heavy charge in scattering, skewering, terrifying, and trampling the victim unit. After the hit there is normally another morale check. I suggested that this one have a penalty (not just be DC10), but perhaps be DC 15 or just have a -4.

    As for being overpowered, I really don't think that's the case. You may have missed it, but under the rules of this game, the cost of all units (or at least heavy units) is being SQUARED. Thus a single unit of knights costs 36GB. If anything, my recommendations don't make it powerful enough yet to be worth the cost of 9 units of standard infantry.

  2. #12
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    Currently, the Royal Bloodlines PBEM has a unit cost as such:

    Unit (Muster/Maintenance) - Muster time in Months
    Archer (4/1) - 2
    Pikeman (4/1) - 2
    Infantry (4/1) - 2
    Irregular (4/1) - 2
    Marine (9/1.5) - 3
    Scout (9/1.5) - 3
    Engineer (16/2) - 4
    Elite Infantry (16/2) - 4
    Cavalry (16/2) - 4
    Knights (36/3) - 6

    As I understand it, the increase in costs was designed to try to calculate the cost of equipping a 120 man unit with appropriate equipment at Player's Handbook prices. It was also intended to more accurately reflect the cost of cavalry and heavy armor.

    To make such increased costs worth investing in, all but the base units need serious upgrades in order to be worth it; otherwise, more lower cost units would be mustered to the complete exclusion of higher cost units, a situation that doesn't really reflect historical trends (which is another stated goal of this PBEM), since realms saw fit to invest in heavier units if they could afford them.

    Now, I think there is some sense in increasing costs and unit strength, particularly for those with heavy armor and/or horses, but I think there are some imbalances, and upgrading the value of a GB to 5,000gp (as this PBEM does) already accomplishes quite a lot. I think the PHB values themselves are not sacred and are often likely wrong from a historical perspective, and also reflect private one-on-one purchases rather than high-volume, government-commissioned production.

    Since the primary cost disparity from the general setting seems to be the high cost of armor and horses (and some advanced weaponry), I think a more unit-by-unit approach would be more accurate, and could easily be implemented in a PBEM just with reference to a revised unit table. In fact, this PBEM's consideration of the matter has lead me to think this would be a better (in terms of more "historical," from a simulationist perspective) set of unit statistics for BR in general

    Basic Assumptions and Base Modifications (if not mentioned, base stats for each category remain the same as in BRCS/wiki):
    - Irregular unit has 0GB base muster cost, only costs 0.5GB for Standard training and 2.5GB for Elite training (no real movement and fighting in formations is required for irregulars, thus requiring less drilling)
    - Archer unit is just an Irregular with +0 melee, +2 missile base, no +2 vs. cavalry (just never really made sense anyway, since cavalry ride farther apart in skirmish order and move faster than infantry units, thus being harder to hit)
    - Cavalry unit is really just an add on to another unit type (infantry, irregular infantry or irregular archer--yes, there can be irregular cavalry, which includes irregular archers), provides +3 to Move, a +2 to Melee, a Charge attack at +2, and a Morale bonus of +2, for a cost of 4GB additional and 1GB more in maintenance.
    - Engineers have a maximum movement rating of 1 and cost 5GB; castles are more expensive and effective in this game, so Engineers will be even more important in counteracting them, so the increase in expense without an increase in stats is justifiable and explains the high cost of machines of war, material, heavy ammunition, and skill training
    - Pikemen increase bonus vs. Cavalry to +4, +8 vs. Charge (so they can hit Cavalry most of the time even against the increased Defense ratings of the Cavalry units)

    Medium Armor (in Anuire, Chainmail + Large Shield) costs 1.5GB, provides Defense 15
    Medium Barding (in Anuire, Chainmail or Scale for mounts) costs 2GB, adds +1 to Defense and +2 to Charge
    Heavy Armor (in Anuire, Half Plate + Large Shield) costs 6.5GB, provides Defense 18, Hits +1, Morale +2 (effectively Toughness Training included)
    Heavy Barding (in Anuire, Half Plate for mounts) costs 6GB, provides +2 to Defense, adds +4 to Charge, scores automatic critical threat, reduces Move by 1

    Elite training costs 3GB instead of 2GB because of all the bonuses they get, and this affects maintenance costs.

    Almost all special training options continue to cost normal amount, but don't modify maintenance costs (salary is not that much different). Toughness training only adds 1 hit, with no morale increase (that must be purchased separately). The only exceptions are the Elite training options for Melee, Missile, and Defense enhancements. These cost 2GB rather than 1GB, as they reflect superior equipment as much as training (elves don't pay these increased costs and indeed, I'd treat elves separately in general).

    Unit (Muster/Maintenance) - Muster Months : unit adjustments from the base units
    Archers (2/1) - 1 : Remove +2 vs. mounted (includes Morale training)
    Pikemen (3/1) - 1 : Defense is 15, bonus vs. mounted = +4, +8 vs. Charge
    Infantry (3/1) - 1 : Defense is 15
    Irregular (1/0.5) - 1 : No adjustments
    Scouts (2/1) - 1 : Morale is only +2; scouts are not hardened battle troops
    Marines (2/1) - 1 : No adjustments
    Engineers (6/2) - 3 : Movement maxes at 1, even if Elite training is taken

    Anuirean Cavalry (9/2) - 2 : Defense is 16, Melee increases to +6, Morale increases to +6, Charge increases to +4, Move increases to 4; Anuirean is specified because this unit has medium barding; other cultures may not equip standard cavalry this way

    Elite Infantry (10GB/2) - 3 : Defense is 18, Hits increase to 4, Morale increases to +8

    Knights (20GB/3) - 3 : Defense is 20, Hits increase to 4, Melee increases to +8, Morale increases increases to +10, Charge increases to +6, scores automatic critical threat
    Last edited by Rowan; 07-14-2009 at 05:59 PM.

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