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  1. #21
    Site Moderator Magian's Avatar
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    Yeah that seems to be a major factor Brin and Ken. I totally agree and I guess the way its set up in ROE and our current campaign its pretty much as you've said with the slight twist that no faction claiming the throne will give up on it either let alone bowing down to an overlord.
    One law, One court, One allied people, One coin, and one tax, is what I shall bring to Cerilia.

  2. #22
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magian View Post
    If you were in the role of playing a regent within Anuire whether it be a Duke of the empire, non-landed regent, supporter of a claimant of the Irone throne, or a Claimant of the Iron Throne, what would it take for you to support a new emperor other than yourself?
    Well the first time we played BR - I ran a paladin of Haelyn with minor regency (temples).

    The regent of Roesone (a PC) and been "our" leader and over the course of many adventures my PC had come to beleive that haelyn had chosen him for some great purpose. How else could he have survived the encounters we had had and done the things he had?

    Now when he joined in backing Avan for his claim to the Iron Throne (after a great war that Avan had backed the PC on by the way - defeating Ghoere) my PC was in a great quandry. He had beleived that the PC was chosen but when he backed someone else it just didn't seem right to him. Didn't matter that the strength of the PC's bloodline was only a low major. still he supported his choice since he was a paladin of Haelyn after all.

    Now in the game I ran the Iron Throne was not claimed although the PCs did recover the Sword of Roele. IMO something like that is highly symbolic for the Anuirean people and would carry a lot of weight.
    Duane Eggert

  3. #23
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    I have always expected that the main way a new Emperor would come to power is if a powerful realm and lord were positioned well during a time of great hardship--much as Ken has outlined. It seems to me that the primary reason that the Gorgon has not attempted a major war and land grab is that he himself would be a catalyst for the rebirth of the Empire, as the only way to stop him might be to unite behind a powerful leader.

    Once there is an emperor, the Gorgon might try to break him immediately, just test him, or (more likely IMO) work behind the scenes to sow chaos and division that will tear the Empire apart again, whether in the current generation or one in the future.

    As for uniting in peace time and during prosperity, there IS a way, I think. First you'd have to have the would-be emperor proving his valor, wisdom, fairness, and faithfulness to Haelyn and Imperial ideals. In peacetime especially, his lineage would indeed matter. He'd need to forge the most powerful faction within the empire, and may even need to win a major victory (likely militarily, though that wouldn't be the only way) over one or more rival factions.

    Then you'd have to convince the independent rulers to submit themselves to an overlord after 500 years--as has been pointed out. To do that, the emperor could indeed offer a few things of worth:
    1. Security from the scourge of traditional awnsheghlien and foes, if possible

    2. A higher place in the new Empire--the newer realms and bloodlines will likely suffer in this equation, as the Dukes would most likely need to be elevated again and given control over larger areas, even if the other states continue to exist as vassal states under their administration. For instance, a marriage or two into the Imperial Family would be necessary for some of the big four (Boeruine, Avanil, Ghoere, Mhoried). Diemed and Aerenwe would likely split the Southern Coast. Ghoere would be elevated to an archduchy. Coeranys would get Cariele and a chunk of Dhoesone back, or the Chimaeron. Mhoried and Elinie would get special official positions as guardians of the East, with command over large Imperial armies and the funding of fortifications and province level increases all along their borders with Markazor (and for Elinie, LPA accepted officially into the Empire). Alamie would likely get Tuornen back, or split it with Boeruine. Brosengae would likely get Taeghas back, or split it with others. If William is restored to Osoerde by Imperial power that might be sufficient for that realm. These sorts of things leave the duchies as the big winners.

    3. There would likely need to be the promise of greater future gains. This would likely require opening up areas to further colonization, secured by Imperial troops; and conquest of other areas of Cerilia (with the great supporting Houses seeing the primary gains).

    4. If the rising "middle class" is a theme in the game, a coalition of powerful guilds could be instrumental in the reforming of the Empire, without whose aid it may be impossible. Powerful guilds could back a claimant, gaining guarantees of trade in the process, and promising wealth to the nobility that supports the reformation of the Empire. They could threaten to not pay any taxes if they didn't get their way, provided they were powerful enough to back up that threat.

    5. A reconstituted Imperial Temple could go a long way towards establishing a new Empire, depending on whether or not it is united enough and powerful enough to get involved more heavily in politics. Certainly the very fact of its reconstitution would make a new Empire more likely, more attractive, in the minds of the nobles and the people than it might otherwise be. If the temples chose to intervene to settle the issue, they may be able to get the Chamberlain to nominate one or more claimants and thus force a vote or series of votes. The Imperial Temple could then choose to back the apparent winner and enforce that through agitation and political and spiritual pressure throughout the Empire, censuring those who oppose the decision and refusing to pay taxes or aid them.

    6. If standard 3.x rules are used, high level wizards are so powerful that PCs above 17th level (or above 20th, if you go epic) could likely slay or intimidate or subjugate enough other wizards to gain such a network of sources and vassal wizards that either a claimant could be quite effectively supported, or the wizard(s) could, through magical charms and such, virtually re-create the Empire themselves. This would end up being more of a tyranny, but hey.

  4. #24

    The Emperor as unifier against external threat

    The only time I ever got close to playing/roleplaying a situation where a "New Emperor" was chosen it was because Anuire was in danger of being over-run by the Gorgon/goblins -- they had taken over Mhoried and Ghoere (never let a player play the Gorgon... especially a good player).
    The other three guys quickly elected an Emperor (Diem, almost as natural choice since I had Avan and Boeruine as NPC... ) the players had to convince most anuirean rulers to organize around their resistance and that was a great game. We then had some players including the Gorgon quit, and that changed the overall dynamic; the last two players got greedy and by that time they were way to high level to keep the game fun.

  5. #25
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrano24100 View Post
    The only time I ever got close to playing/roleplaying a situation where a "New Emperor" was chosen it was because Anuire was in danger of being over-run by the Gorgon/goblins -- they had taken over Mhoried and Ghoere (never let a player play the Gorgon... especially a good player).
    The other three guys quickly elected an Emperor (Diem, almost as natural choice since I had Avan and Boeruine as NPC... ) the players had to convince most anuirean rulers to organize around their resistance and that was a great game. We then had some players including the Gorgon quit, and that changed the overall dynamic; the last two players got greedy and by that time they were way to high level to keep the game fun.
    Let me see

    You had the Gorgon being played as PC and Avan and Boeruine as NPCs?

    No wonder things worked that way.
    Duane Eggert

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