D&D vers. 3.6

[geeman]

OK, folks, having had some time to absorb 4e in some detail I have a
suggestion: It`s like chocolate. It`s tasty and it`s sweet and maybe
it even makes us happy when we have it, but in the long run it`s not
really good for us. That is, it`s a perfectly workable system, and
I`m sure playing it will be an enjoyable gaming experience for those
who give it a shot and play objectively, but in many ways it`s not a
good fit for Birthright. Its tone/flavour is off. The scale goes in
a different direction. It emphasizes crunchy combat characteristics
where we need more subtle savory taste to portray things like the
domain level of play, the the interaction of characters as social
competitors, and characters who might be in conflict with their own
bloodline as much as with others (before they try to kill each
other....) Worst of all, it looks like as a system for customization
it is the very opposite of 3.5. That is, it would require a LOT of
work to make it something that suits a setting other than a
not-too-different variation what is now the standard D&D game
world. Where 3e-3.5 worked perfectly well for Birthright with a few
tweaks here and there, it`d be awful hard to do Birthright 4e--and I
don`t think the end result would be all that satisfying.

But, also like chocolate, a little bit is a good thing. It makes
life a lot more pleasant, and in moderation we can enjoy 4e in
perfect health. A few of the ideas of 4e are completely workable for
Birthright. Some of them just make sense as an edition of D&D. The
way the system handles hit points, for example, is the kind of thing
I plan on using. I like the more compact skill system (though I`m
going to have to tweak that a bit) and how it interacts with
character class/level.

So my plan is to do a sort of retroactive game mechanics
alteration--a "retmech" if you will. I`m tentatively calling this
concept D&D 3.6, and am planning on using it as the basis for my
future work with Birthright (and D&D in general, most likely....)

My questions to the Birthright community are these:

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could be "borrowed" to work in
a version between 3.5 and 4e, with our favorite setting as the major emphasis?

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could NOT be used in
Birthright for a 3.6 version of D&D?

Gary

[Lee]

In a message dated 8/5/2008 10:20:55 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
geeman@SOFTHOME.NET writes:

My questions to the Birthright community are these:

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could be "borrowed" to work in
a version between 3.5 and 4e, with our favorite setting as the major
emphasis?

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could NOT be used in
Birthright for a 3.6 version of D&D?


I`d like to throw in a curveball: are you aware of Paizo`s attempt to write
a "3.75", known as Pathfinder RPG? know very little about it, beyond that
it`s an "improved" 3.5, intended for the Pathfinder adventure paths they were
writing.

Having said that, I have not played 4e at all, only skimmed the PH, so I do
not feel I cannot comment meaningfully. Skill challenges sound like a neat
idea, though.

Lee.



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[geeman]

At 07:42 PM 8/5/2008, Lee wrote:

>I`d like to throw in a curveball: are you aware of Paizo`s attempt to write
>a "3.75", known as Pathfinder RPG? know very little about it, beyond that
>it`s an "improved" 3.5, intended for the Pathfinder adventure paths
>they were
>writing.

I hadn`t heard of that. I`ll poke around and see what they`ve got in
mind. At the very least it might have some ideas for D&D 3.6 (or
Birthright D20.1....)

Gary

[bbeau22]

Yeah my friend is running a campaign in the pathfinding series. They are taking some of the good ideas of 4th edition and including them in.

The offical rules of 3.75 haven't been offically created yet. I think they are going to come out with their own player guide type book next year. They do have a cheat sheet of sorts that gives some of their ideas.

-BB

[kgauck]

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could be "borrowed" to work in a version between 3.5 and 4e, with our favorite setting as the major emphasis?

I like something good every level (not necessarily powerful, just useful). Dead levels are no fun.

I like the magic system better than nearly anything else I have seen. I have a long record as a tinkerer with magic systems. I want the whole thing, not just rituals.

Using spell focus devices is a great solution to a desire I have had for a long time. classical wizards all seem to carry staves or wands. Why? It must be useful, but mechanizing it was always a problem. Is it a spell storing device, or what? The 4e solution is very nice.

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could NOT be used in Birthright for a 3.6 version of D&D?

Certainly we don't need to make every class have the same effectiveness in combat.

The skill system is extremely broad. Too much so, I think.

[Beruin]

Regarding pathfinder, you should check out Paizo's webpage - they offer an "alpha" version, a 160+-pages pdf, as a free download. I didn't read it very thoroughly, but basically pathfinder beefs up the core classes a bit, to make it worthwhile to pursue the class up to 20th level and to bring them up to par with core classes published in WotC's later supplements like the scout.

Some rules like the infamous grappling rules are also streamlined/changed, but the pathfinder rules strive to be compatible with 3.5. I haven't seen any concepts borrowed from 4e, but this might just be my oversight.

Speaking of 4e, most of what I like/dislike results from "gut feeling" as I haven't yet spent too much time on studying it.

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could be "borrowed" to work in
a version between 3.5 and 4e, with our favorite setting as the major emphasis?

I like saving throws working like armour class, i.e. are passive.

Passive skill checks (spotting, listening) are also very useful.

The idea that wounds have an effect before you fall unconscious ("bloodied") also appeals to me.

I loathed the idea at first, but now I think that healing surges might be a good idea, though I'd make them more rare.

What aspects of 4e do you think should/could NOT be used in
Birthright for a 3.6 version of D&D?

I won't use the magic system. Then again I already use a skill-based spell point system offering more variability than the old Vancian system without giving Mages energy bolts at will.

I agree with Kenneth on the skill system being to broad and I also dislike the emphasis on level. In 3.xe, you could create low-level NPCs that were nevertheless quite good in specific skills, with maximum ranks and skill focus. Now, level is most important.

That you add 1/2 your level to initiative also doesn't fit into a "grittier" BR.