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  1. #11
    Site Moderator geeman's Avatar
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    At 02:50 PM 7/24/2008, Rey wrote:

    >Any meaningful purpose for doing this? What`s the prize?

    I do have a more direct relationship to game mechanics and the
    setting in mind, but I`d prefer not to get too much into detail about
    it for now as the ideas as still forming.

    Even if nothing else comes of it, though, it is a way of thinking
    about these characters that might be useful in playing them as a
    DM.... Things like the signs of the Zodiac and the four elements
    have long been used to portray personality and character (not to
    mention little things like fate and health...) so they can be used as
    shorthand for a system of describing NPCs in the way that 4e outlines
    the "Personality" and "Mannerisms."

    Gary

  2. #12
    Site Moderator Sorontar's Avatar
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    Chinese astrology

    Don't forget the Chinese astrology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_astrology)

    * Venus — Metal (gold)
    * Jupiter — Wood
    * Mercury — Water
    * Mars — Fire
    * Saturn — Earth

    The twelve Zodiac animal signs: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, sheep (ram or goat), monkey, rooster, dog, and boar .

    Plus you have Yin and Yang forms of the elements.

    These can be applied to hours, seasons, years and combine in 60 ways for people. So a person (namely me) can be regarded as being a Yin Water Ox (I'm not telling you my "secret animal" :^) .

    Sorontar

  3. #13
    Site Moderator geeman's Avatar
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    OK, we`ve got some ideas for the Zodiac and the elements.... Here`s
    where things are going to get a little weirder.... What if you were
    going to categorize the awnsheghlien according to which of the seven
    deadly sins they most embody? There`s a little variation in how the
    sins are sometimes described, but to keep it simple, let`s assume they are:

    Lust
    Gluttony
    Greed
    Sloth
    Wrath
    Envy
    Pride

    Like the elemental idea, one could put a particular character in more
    than one group. The Gorgon is mostly Wrath, but he`s also got a lot
    of Envy going on. The Basilisk is likely Sloth. The Lamia is
    Lust. Etc. What others might you folks see?

    Gary

  4. #14
    Ehrshegh of Spelling Thelandrin's Avatar
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    Rhuobhe typifies Pride and Wrath, whereas the Spider is also Sloth.

    Ius Hibernicum, in nomine juris. Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.

  5. #15
    Site Moderator geeman's Avatar
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    At 03:10 AM 7/25/2008, Thelandrin wrote:

    >Rhuobhe typifies Pride and Wrath, whereas the Spider is also Sloth.

    That`s interesting. I hadn`t really thought of it, but you`re right:
    sloth does describe the Spider pretty well.... It`s sometimes hard
    to get past the more obvious, insane aspect of his personality.

    Let me tweak this question a little, as it`s a bit much to categorize
    ALL of the awnsheghlien according to the seven deadly sins. Rather,
    which ones are the best fit for them? That is, which awnshegh best
    describes Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Sloth, Wrath, Envy and Pride?

    Gary

  6. #16
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    I certainly think its worth while to look at this with fresh eyes. But it can also be fruitful to look back and see what the forum has said on this subject before. In Feb 2003, under the thread "Azrai`s 2000 parts" there as a discussion of the seven deadly sins and how they illuminated both the awnies and the gods.

  7. #17
    Administrator Green Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geeman View Post
    At 03:10 AM 7/25/2008, Thelandrin wrote:

    >Rhuobhe typifies Pride and Wrath, whereas the Spider is also Sloth.

    That`s interesting. I hadn`t really thought of it, but you`re right:
    sloth does describe the Spider pretty well.... It`s sometimes hard
    to get past the more obvious, insane aspect of his personality.

    Let me tweak this question a little, as it`s a bit much to categorize
    ALL of the awnsheghlien according to the seven deadly sins. Rather,
    which ones are the best fit for them? That is, which awnshegh best
    describes Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Sloth, Wrath, Envy and Pride?

    Gary
    Serpent - Pride

    He fancies himself a great statesman, "protector" of an entire race (Masetians) and a god...


    Gorgon - Envy

    He envies his brothers...and it defines all that he is.


    Wrath - The Manslayer
    Last edited by Thelandrin; 07-27-2008 at 12:46 PM. Reason: Merging of triple-post.
    Cheers
    Bjørn
    DM of Ruins of Empire II PbeM

  8. #18
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    The Lamia is another candidate for Pride.

  9. #19
    Site Moderator geeman's Avatar
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    At 05:56 PM 7/25/2008, kgauck wrote:

    >The Lamia is another candidate for Pride.

    Pun intended?

    The Lamia seems like such a slam dunk for lust... unless there`s
    another candidate out among the degenerate scions of Azrai who is
    more appropriate.

    Others:

    Gluttony -- Boar, Leviathan, Vampire
    Pride/Vanity -- Banshegh, Chimaera, White Witch
    Lust -- Siren, Lamia
    Greed -- Magian, Seadrake
    Sloth -- Basilisk, Spider
    Wrath -- Gorgon, Rhoubhe
    Envy -- Hag

    The Raven might fall into a couple of categories, but he remains a
    bit too secretive to really define well. The Gorgon could exemplify
    three or four of the deadly sins.... Roubhe strikes me as being
    mostly about wrath, but he`s also got a lot of pride.

    Gary

  10. #20
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geeman View Post
    The Lamia seems like such a slam dunk for lust... unless there`s
    another candidate out among the degenerate scions of Azrai who is more appropriate.
    I don't think the Lamia is either the subject or the object of lust. As far as the Seven Deadlies go, lust us bad because it causes ruin. The Lamia's domain is not endangered by her lust. As for the men she controls, one could interpret her charm ability as a magically induced lust, or simply as a charm with sex specificity. As the later it has no more moral implication than any other charm spell. As the former, while it does prey on a human weakness, to the extent that it is a charm and not the weakness that ruins them, its not a sin.

    While the corruption of the Gorgon's pride is critical to his overall corruption, and likewise with many other awnies, the Lamia is not brought low by Lust. However, she beggers her realm (greed) to express her vanity (pride). Since the demands for money serve the purpose of pride and not acquisition for acquisition's sake, I'd say its all Pride.

    Quote Originally Posted by CotS
    The Lamia concerns herself more with wealth and power than with her subjects and often demands crushing taxes to fund personal vanities such as monuments to herself or expensive trappings for her court.
    Blood enemies calls her proud, and describes her beauty as a weapon to defraud. Her lust was for power and wealth (both greed) not sex. "She now uses her domain to fund her vainglorious monuments and trappings of her rule." Nothing about her says she pursues sex, or has a weakness for sex. One could make an argument for greed, but I think pride is the real weakness of the Lamia. She cannot abide a the sight of a pretty woman, not as a rival, or jealously, but because it reminds her of her lost human beauty, the things for which she was most proud.

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