Avanil

[ShadowMoon]

My thoughts exactly...

Probably the Imperial City and surrounding lands like province of Anuire (Avanil) were remains of Roele's kingdom which were destroyed in Godswar cataclysm.

[Dcolby]

Darien Avan's entirely too arrogant attitude

Here, here I agree entirely, not only does he hide his Azrai bloodline (I can't let it go it just tickles me...sorry) but the Avanils' confiscated Imperial Lands to back their flimsy claim of blood!!

Maybe I should be Boeruines' press agent?? He comes off as way to uptight...Nearly as bad as Avans' arrogant ways..

[Dcolby]

The idea of land outside Anuire is very valid though-

I seem to recall that many of the conquered territories had Governors under the old Imperial system in Anuire. Surely these lucretive appointments were another way the Old Emperors ensured loyalty and supplemented the power of their Avanese holdings by handing out the choice cuts to the trustworthy. The promise of a governorship for the Son, Nephew or Cousin of a duke could by a lot of loyalty and maybe even set Dukes against one another to earn such rewards.

[dalor]

You only have to look at the history of the Japanese Empire to see why an Emporer could, for all intents and purposes, be without real holdings and still hold onto (in Japans case) at least nominal power.

Tradition can go a long way.

[kgauck]

Japanese emperors tend to be figureheads, and there are long periods in which they are powerless figureheads. Certainly the Emperor of Anuire is something more than a cerimonial office.

[Dcolby]

Japanese emperors tend to be figureheads, and there are long periods in which they are powerless figureheads. Certainly the Emperor of Anuire is something more than a cerimonial office.

They were also thought to have divine ancestory...& perhaps that same connection of blood relation to a God also played a small part in the power of the Anuirean Emperors.

Extensive Personal Holdings..
Theoretical Ownership of All other lands..
Traditions and apparatus of leadership resting in the Roele line..
Control of Overseas and Conquered territorial Governorships,
and a tangible "Divine Right" would make for a very, very powerful and very very heavy crown. No small wonder the "Empire" went to hell in a handbasket with the ending of the Roele line.

[ShadowMoon]

IMHO, the "Divine Right" was the main factor why Roeles were Emperors for so long, beeing that Haelyn is a patron of Anuire afterall. Imperial Temple was certanly making sure to remind Anuireans (nobles and serves alike) of this, thus securing Roele's right as well as their religious supremacy.
No one would openly chalenge Roele imperial line and/or their right, many probably hoped and schemed to bring Roeles down, but as long as Roeles had legitimate heirs, Iron Throne was in their hands.

Probably before the Godswar, Roeles needed strong material power and cunning politics to support their position as Emperors, but after the "Light" forces triumph over the Shadow, and Haelyn's ascendancy in Anduiras place, under the Roeles banner, they secured the Iron Throne forever.

[kgauck]

Let's not forget that this thread has mostly maintained itself on the question of whether the emperor owned lands directly himself. The objection that Andrew and I have made is that without a substantial base of direct power, theorical power becomes worthless. Machiavelli, in his Discourses on Livy, suggests it can last a single generation but not two. If the Emperor had a seccure base of power aproximating a duchy, had lands in the duchies, controlled things in the lands were Imperial Govorners were appointed, and had some kind of broad tax (and Andrew is correct to suggest its not a direct tax, kings of England had a tax on wool and kings of France had a tax on salt), then we're talking about real power, and the ideological componants, Haelyn's teachings, traditional deference, habits of obediance, oaths of obligation, reinforce and support real power. but, without real power, without direct access to GB and RP, ideological support alone will not produce any tangible power.

[Thelandrin]

It's entirely possible that the Emperors had widespread holdings throughout Anuire. They may have held various Haelyn temple holdings, probably controlled a lot of law holdings in various countries and almost certainly held great chunks of Avanil. Chances are too that they were the only regents in the Imperial City.

[kgauck]

My own sense is that they, in medieval fashion, controlled the economy through excessive regulation and taxation as well. In game terms, they owned the guilds, but made less money per holding. There seems to be a lot of color to the effect that guilders are on the rise, and that their role is new. Who then controlled these holdings previously? If the medieval world is our model, the crown.