Couple unit ideas for critique/balance discussion

[Starmage21]

my first idea is golems. These guys would be serious tanks on a battlefield, unfortunately, the cost to create them in the DMG is prohibitive(even on a gold bar standard).

Muster cost: High? The cost to buy a stone golem on the open market is 90,000gp or about 45 Gold Bars!
Maintenance cost: 1/4 GB why? Golems dont need much, except the odd spell to heal their damage, and a few "golem wranglers" who order the golem about in battle.
Defense: 28-30; Golems have Dr 15/Adamantine, and they cant be critically hit. No footsoldier stands a chance at harming it, but then maybe the unit is carrying a few special measures in the rear ranks. A veteran unit should have a very hard time hitting the golem, and an attached hero unit should be able to affect the unit enough to make the rare hit.
Hits: 2-3; the odd chance that they are damaged, you would think it would be from artillery fire or a rare weapon capable of dealing more than 15 damage on a hit. Even so, any damage they do take is going to be small.
Ranged: no
Melee: High Maybe +12 or greater. Even against fortifications, a golem will smash its way through walls to complete it's objective.
Morale:--(nonability) even if the golem wranglers run away or get killed, the golem would still try to complete it's objective. As such it should be considered alot like an undead unit.


"fluff" - I figure a unit of golems is actually a single golem (like a naval unit) with a smattering of lesser unimportant troops whose sole job is to order the golem around. Even though it is unrealistic that a single golem could deal significant damage to a unit of 200 men at arms, you have to consider the way this thing might fight. It would probobly be ordered to charge into the middle of units (trampling/killing several men in the process) and each round its going to kill 2 men at arms. I figure a battle round is alot longer than a D&D round simply because a battle like we're used to seeing would last minutes or longer. That gives a golem ample time to crush and kill 200+ men at arms.

[Thorogood Roele]

Indeed golems would be deadly on the battlefield, but let's not forget just one thing..... remember just how high level of a mage is required to create one. This makes it nearly impossible to even do, after you have the insane amount of gold required for one. Then factor the chances that their may be a mage on the opposite side that can destroy it, and no right minded ruler would even consider risking 45GB on one, when he could instead have a dozen units of knights on the field for the same price.

[Mikal]

actually a mage would be useless: magic immunity for golems. And thats sort of the point for the unit: yes you can buy one unit of golem for the price of ten knights, but it'll take those ten knights to destroy the golem: a sort of shock and awe unit

[graham anderson]

One of the mages in khinasi uses gholems but they are not given unit stats If I remember correctly. They sound mighty hard though.

[Fizz]

One of the mages in khinasi uses gholems but they are not given unit stats If I remember correctly. They sound mighty hard though.

Are you referring to the Meharmaine, created by el-Sirad (formerly of Khourane)?

The 3E Birthright document has them in the monster chapter. They're not golems in the standard MM sense, but are very golem-like.


-Fizz

[graham anderson]

yes that is what I was thinking of they are like unique golems. It is possible in a game but very very rare and expensive.

[Starmage21]

so, now that the possibility question is aside, how should it be balanced?

Should I work along the lines that if it takes a veteran unit a 19-20 to hit and damage the thing, than it should cost as much to muster as 19-20 units of veteran soldiers?

The undead have awesome defense too, and I figured thats because of their toughness(Damage Reduction in regular D&D), so along those lines is where my proposed golem defense numbers come from.

[graham anderson]

I would prefer rare/unigue things like this to be balanced by their initial cost and the time needed to be researched along with a high caster level. Also maybe rare components that need to be found.

Similarly someone could hire/make a unit of giants in birthright with a good adventure etc and such a unit would also be mighty powerfull but expensive. A few more units races etc in the brcs would be good. I know I have made some up in my time.

[graham anderson]

Maybe I wasn't too clear I would think a set number of turns to produce such a unit if componets are around and a large initial cost with a small amount of upkeep if you manage to make it.

[Starmage21]

Maybe I wasn't too clear I would think a set number of turns to produce such a unit if componets are around and a large initial cost with a small amount of upkeep if you manage to make it.

I would assume that since gp costs to create are given that magical components are readily available, just that the culture of magic makes magic items rare in the high magic world of cerilia.

The biggest feat I would imagine is convincing the spellcasters of the realms to create the unit for you.

That whole "Magic belongs in the hands of those whove earned the right to wield it" deal might be the biggest thing to overcome.

Mustering a unit over several turns might lessen the hit on the nations economy for 1 big unit instead of several smaller ones.