Why is the Gorgon so powerful?

[Green Knight]

Yes, Raesene is indeed the elder (bastard) brother of Haelyn and Roele.

I tend to think think that no-one, even someone as powerful as the Gorgon, could ever hope to juts walk around conquering anything on his own. Even personally very powerful regents need an apparatus of government to do their work for them.

So I'm not sure the Gorogn needs to be limited to remaining on his home turf in Battlewaite. The need to keep his domain running would likely eat up almost all of his time. It is after all a HUGE domain, with multiple vassals (not all of which are too happy with their status), numerous races (many of which like infighting as much as the next orc), and a serious trust issue regarding other scions (a problem in a world where successful rulers are scions). Hell, he's even got maintain a very large source network, which neighbors many powerful mage regents. And so on and so on...

So I don't think the Gorgon is literally bound to Battlewaite, but he is bound none the less. Maybe he rouses once evry generation or two, to lead his army on a campaign or something...but for the most part he's locked in his study, reading ducuments and giving orders to (incompetent) underlings...

[Osprey]

a level 30 fighter with 18 con and no fortitude related feats or magic items would have a total fortitude save of 21 (12 base + 4 ability + 5 epic) So at this rate, our fighter would have to gain 36 more levels or some serious feats/magic items before anything other than a natural 20 would save his skin. Evidently entering into melee or point blank range of the gorgon is suicide for anything shy of a level 70 character if I have done my math correctly. I guess this is so hypothetical because by then you should have more than 18 con and atleast something that gives a bonus to your fortitude. . . but still, what about characters who don't have very high fortitude saves or constititution isn't their strong suit. I mean, if the developers want him to be invulnerable to melee that's fine I guess. Maybe one of the developers has some input on the subject.
__________________
Regards,
Ausrick

It wasn't too long after I read the BRCS Gorgon writeup that I figured death ward was a person's only real hope of surviving his death gaze. Then there's his petrifying gaze, of which the only real counter I know is stone to flesh. Can't think of any real defense against that, though, other than pumped-up fortitude saves.

Stacking save bonuses are the only things give your 30th level fighter a chance to make an epic-level fortitude save. Bard songs (Inspire Heroics, +4 morale bonuse to saves), spells (prayer, +1 luck; moment of presience, +20 insight on 1 save; spell resistance; etc), and magic items (cloak of resistance, or another item that grants a resistance bonus to saves; amulet of health).

[Walter]

Osprey wrot:
Then there's his petrifying gaze, of which the only real counter I know is
Quote:
stone to flesh
. Can't think of any real defense against that, though, other than pumped-up fortitude saves.

What about spells like gaze screen 50% immunity.


What everybody should remember is that the Gorgon is nearly a deity, a qusi deity. His goals are a mystery but in Ruins of Impire it is mentioned that he is actually trying to get get the power of Kreisha and Belinik a fuul time job i think.
The question why he has not conquered Anuire is easy to anwer: Who is interested in the wellfare of the Anurians, who initiated the foundation of the Empire and who is strong enough to beat the Gorgon? His halfbrother Haylin succesor of Andurias and Grater Deity.

[Osprey]

The question why he has not conquered Anuire is easy to anwer: Who is interested in the wellfare of the Anurians, who initiated the foundation of the Empire and who is strong enough to beat the Gorgon? His halfbrother Haylin succesor of Andurias and Grater Deity.

I think your response better answers this question:
"Why hasn't the Gorgon ascended to godhood already?"

After Deismaar and the catastrophic death of the old gods, the new generation of gods swore to a pact to never again become as directly involved in the affairs of mortals as their predecessors were. If the Gorgon were to attain true godhood, then Haelyn and his allies (Cuiraecen, Neserie, maybe some of the others, maybe all of the gods) would certainly feel it was their duty to remove Raesene from the mortal realms of Aebrynis.

If the Gorgon is already a deity (even a demigod), then why haven't Haelyn and his buddies stepped in to deal with his rampages already?

Some good food for thought.

Osprey

[irdeggman]

After Deismaar and the catastrophic death of the old gods, the new generation of gods swore to a pact to never again become as directly involved in the affairs of mortals as their predecessors were.
Osprey

Actually the text (in both BRCS and BRRB) is:

Fearing a repetition of Deismaar in any future conflicts, the gods agreed to a universal pact: Never to battle each other in physical form.

And several have directly involved themselves - Ruornil (in Medoere) and the text about Eloéle in the BoP and her "gifts" to followers.

[Walter]

Originally Posted by Osprey:
If the Gorgon is already a deity (even a demigod), then why haven't Haelyn and his buddies stepped in to deal with his rampages already?

He is not a demigod he is a quasi/hero deity. Compare the description of such beeings in deities and Demigods page 25-27 and the stats of The Gorgon in the BRCS-Playtest Page 171/173 he is one, spell resitence, immunities, damage reduction and fire immunity.

BRCS page 35
True bloodlines are unique. Only the greatest heroes of Deismaar, those who were both physically and philosophically closest to the expiring gods, were granted True bloodlines. Only these surviving heroes or their direct heirs through bloodline investiture have True bloodlines. There are believed to be less than a dozen true bloodlines in existence.
All known True bloodlines are currently possessed by powerful awnshegh or ehrshegh. These individuals are near demigods and are rumored to be able to grant a divine connection that allows their followers access to divine magic. Some True scions are rumored to have other divine abilities beyond the ken of most mortals.

The Gorgon is nearly a demigod.

All i wanted to say is that the Gorgon has, in my opinion, other goals than conquer Anuire he is trying to become a real god if it is only demigod. Cerellia has nothing to offer to him, no one could challeche him, nothing is to gain, he alredy is the riches and most powerfull ruler of the world. To reign over Anuire would bring him nothing than trouble. But if he stays in his realm he has enough time searching a way to become a real god and harvest one Bloodline after the other with a little bit of excitement.

PS: A fight against the Gorgon is useless, everythig that could be found in Cerellia even epic-level PC would be death in seconds.

[Master Spaz]

lol
i guess that was the first thing my power hungry players wanted since the first game... i dont know why... lol
But after 7 years of fighting in real time... (crazy gaming) they did
I hear other masters laughing... my Birthright campaign is 460 game long for now 11 years, I definitly had to kill Gorgon if I was to keep my players in...
Then you surely wants to know how;
it took 3 generations of Caraesene from Talinie to kill him; acquiering magical item after each generations...lol crazy
That's the only way to play the death of your ... HEAVY PIECE in Anuire... in a way that the game remain credible.
Then I used Eyeless One as center evil, and after him Diabolysk, the ancient inquisitor of Raesene... (and then after Raven, a secriet society in Muden and even an multiracial apocalyptical doom; honestly we went too far... lol)

And you must kill him in a way, for this is the first peon to play as master to go trough the whole Birthright Campaign; i-e restore the planet to health (destroy the evil force that curse the fea world (the shadow world... you know)
Your real greatest ennemy is Cold Rider... and the losts remaining (go to the lost section)
The cold rider is the key; it is the life force of Azrai imprisonned on the Aebrynis planet. All the villains in the Campaign can be attached in a way to this statement; the white witch... who venere the Rider through Kriesha, Raven, the Losts, etc... You will eventually plan a catastrophic scenario where some illuminated (such as Lativius the Blind) priest of Azrai from Aduria try to raise Azrai from his long sleep... ouf
So dont fear to let go Gorgon; be sure to kill a pc who must restart as heir of the killed PC; and take your time, but kill it...
lol

Birthright is THE game for the real players...

[Walter]

Master Spaz:
lol i guess that was the first thing my power hungry players wanted since the first game... i dont know why... lol
But after 7 years of fighting in real time... (crazy gaming) they did
I hear other masters laughing... my Birthright campaign is 460 game long for now 11 years, I definitly had to kill Gorgon if I was to keep my players in...

Well done, it is ok kill that little Bastard, but only when it is neccesary for the game and it is not over.
You are playing one Birthrigt campaing for 11 Years? And it took seven years to kill him? Wonderfull, thats the way it meant to be played, oh yeah.
I NEVER had a campaing lastig longer than 3Years, you are a lucky man.


BAck to the Gorgon.
He should only be as powerful as a Dm need it. Te Version in the BRCS is the most powerfull i have ever seen, and i have seen over a dozen of Gorgon versions. In my opinion the BRCS Veersion is much to powerfull he never could be beaten in a normal campaing. But other versions can, look at the original in Blood enemies there his is big, strong and evil but beatable, 20th level figther, nothing most can handle but not invincible.
A Dm has every right to kill any PC but he should make it reasonable.


Master Spaz:
So dont fear to let go Gorgon; be sure to kill a pc who must restart as heir of the killed PC; and take your time, but kill it...lol

good idea, i will remember it.


MY players killed the Gorgon, they needed 3 Years and the last of killed it, well not killed it, but imprisoned him with the imprison spell and he let the dragon free, that was not the end of the game but the problem was one player 18level and the rest dead, so we started a new campaign.
PS: The Gorgon was not the Gorgon from BRCS which is, as i wrote before is a quasideity and not beatable for mortals.

[ausrick]

just a funny note, I was flipping through my boxed set the other day getting ready for a gaming session and stumbled on the original cardboard gorgon sheet. That thing lists him as a level 20 fighter and a level 15 wizard, dual classed. Thats enough to make any 2nd ed characters squirm. The funny thing is that certain things capped out in second Edition. Saving throws could ony be soo bad. AC could never be better than -10. Etc. The very nature of 3.5 and epic levels just takes the ceiling off of the Gorgon. Just a funny thought as I was thumbing through papers.

[arlyquino]

ya, i noticed that too, when i was trying to compare the old gorgon to the new one. 20th ftr/15th wiz is pretty powerful in 2ed, but the 3ed changes are definitely through the roof.