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  1. #1

    Seeming Strength and Score

    I have the Bloodspawn book and have read it all, but there is a lot that needs clarifying. My main question is: How can someone with Seeming strength and score increase their power? Only by long-term exposure to the Shadow World, or can they increase it in a similar manner to blood strength? Or something else?

    Thanks,
    LaeAndril Rayn

  2. #2
    Senior Member Doyle's Avatar
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    I don't think there is a set ruling for that outside of time spent in the SW (at least in 2nd ed.).
    I play it (IMC) that a non-SW native being only gains Seeming after gaining Seeming Perception (one point Seeming for every five points Perception) - in a Cthulhuesque manner, the more you learn, the more you become a part of it. Perception is gained only by intentional study (books, sages, etc), travel in the SW, encountering SW natives (that are obviously different from Cerilian creatures) and encountering Raw Seeming.

    I don't like the idea of using a system similar to blood-theft for upping the Seeming score (slay a SW critter, gain 1 Seeming point) - it feels wrong IMHO and would make it just seem an alternative to bloodline, cheapening bloodlines.
    Reading that over, I know I'm not being very clear - powers derived from bloodline should show the character using a divine (even if evil) aspect, while powers from Seeming should be almost a horror aspect using the character.

    Regards,
    Doyle.

  3. #3
    Thank you for the input. I didn't really like the idea of "stealing" Seeming powers, either. I am just trying to see if there is an actual set of rules that governs how someone can gain (or lose) Seeming strength. The 5:1 ratio you use seems pretty fair and logical. I am going to play around with different Perception:Seeming ratios and whatnot.

    I do have another question, though. All of my PCs are Regents; since they're Regents, they get more in terms of power and abilities than a normal character (duh). With that in mind, do you think it plausible to start each of them off with a 1 or 2 Seeming Perception? My idea behind it is that they're Regents, so they have a rich history and travel around a lot. During their history and lengthy travels, they were bound to wander through parts of Cerilia where the Shadow World was creeping in (of course, they didn't know they traveled through an area where the SW was creeping in; not until it was too late, anyway). Considering that, maybe they've had enough exposure in their past to obtain a 1 or 2 Perception?

  4. #4
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    I agree. `Stealing' seeming powers isn't appropriate. The Seeming isn't a power so much as the environment. You have to spend time in the environment to adapt to it.

    For example, catching a fish doesn't make you a better swimmer. You have to spend time in the water and learn it for yourself. So neither should slaying a denizen of the Shadow World make you more capable of perceiving or utilizing the Seeming.

    That's my take anyways...

    -Fizz

  5. #5
    Senior Member Doyle's Avatar
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    Starting Seeming perception

    Quote Originally Posted by LaeAndril Rayn
    ... do you think it plausible to start each of them off with a 1 or 2 Seeming Perception? My idea behind it is that they're Regents, so they have a rich history and travel around a lot. During their history and lengthy travels, they were bound to wander through parts of Cerilia where the Shadow World was creeping in (of course, they didn't know they traveled through an area where the SW was creeping in; not until it was too late, anyway). Considering that, maybe they've had enough exposure in their past to obtain a 1 or 2 Perception?
    hmmm.. the Regent has a rich history or the family line has a rich history?

    To say that the Regent has the history suggests that you are starting the characters with a pre-written past that included encounters with the SW creeping in. If this is the case almost any amount of perception would make sense, graduated with the exposure to SW seeming effects. For example: has conversed at length with a denizen of the SW: 1-2 points, frequently uses SW gates to travel around Cerilia: 5-10 points. But then you would have to add all these things into the character description, your plotlines and the game structure.

    If the Regents family line has a rich history (much easier to play with), then the amout of perception points could be based on the amount of information gleaned in the family library (great-uncle Dworkins travel diaries perhaps), some traditional family initiation ("before I can name you as heir, my child, you must sit vigil from midnight in the crypt of my father Oberon. If while you are there, you can pick the fruit from the trees that were not there when you entered and return it to me, I will name you heir of this troubled realm"). Each of these should be worth about a single (starting) point of Seeming perception."

    IMC (mostly non-regents) getting the first few points is fairly easy, but thereafter is progressively difficult. For example, by study of the detailed notes of a sage that has actually travelled the SW and encountered seeming effects, first page = first (1) point, chapter (10 pages) = second point, book (100 pages) = third point. At this stage no more study will generate Seeming perception points until another method of exposure is encountered, perhaps a few hours stuck in the SW. After obtaining 5 points of perception, it might take a week of exposure or reading 5 new studies into the SW to gain the next one and so on. After encountering a the Faerie court (SW elves - 2-3 points depending on time spent with them), I might say to the PC that one of the prevoius books read alluded to Faeries and if the PC re-reads that book, the PC gains 1 more point because of a better understanding of what is read.

  6. #6
    That makes a lot of sense. I had some pre-notions about how I was going to do it, and the examples you have shown me reinforced them. Thanks for all the information

    Lae'Andril Rayn

    P.S. I don't suppose there are "stats" that exist for the Cold Rider?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaeAndril Rayn
    P.S. I don't suppose there are "stats" that exist for the Cold Rider?
    Since know one really knows who/what the Cold Rider is, probably not.

    I understand him to be a nebulous semi-conscious malevolence. Like a fog- you can sense it, be surrounded by it, but you can't exactly touch it or manipulate it. In which case, stats are kind of pointless.

    Perhaps others have other ideas or more information...


    -Fizz

  8. #8
    Senior Member Doyle's Avatar
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    Cold Rider

    Quote Originally Posted by LaeAndril Rayn
    P.S. I don't suppose there are "stats" that exist for the Cold Rider?
    One of the theories is that the Cold Rider is Azrai - either his corpse shadow (under the same theory as the spectral scoin), Azrai (in the process of becoming) reborn, or something created at the SW Mount Diessmaar from Azrai's divine essence - suggesting perhaps why the Azrai derivation to bloodlines is less common that the others despite being approximately as powerful a six other deities put together.

    To actually answer the question, the Cold Rider is either a deity or similar and there are no stats for the deities in the BR material (at least in the original stuff). If you really want stats for the Cold Rider, work out which version of the Cold Rider you want to run, or (my preference) approximate the stats for Haelyn, make it Lawful or Neutral Evil and add 20-30 levels of Necromancer.
    Last edited by Doyle; 12-24-2005 at 08:11 PM.

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    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doyle
    One of the theories is that the Cold Rider is Azrai - either his corpse shadow (under the same theory as the spectral scoin), Azrai (in the process of becoming) reborn, or something created at the SW Mount Diessmaar from Azrai's divine essence - suggesting perhaps why the Azrai derivation to bloodlines is less common that the others despite being approximately as powerful a six other deities put together.
    Actually the most likely reason that the Azrai bloodline is less common is because scions of Azrai are more likely to committ bloodtheft (the Spider discovered it afterall) and hence feed on each other. So while less common they tend to be stronger because of this.

    Check the "Rich Baker's Secret files" in the FAQ section for some related information from the man himself.

    But only read it if you really, really want to know.
    Duane Eggert

  10. #10
    I continue to be amazed by how many ideas I share with people here. I had already started writing up some storyline for my campaign on how the Cold Rider was going to be some manifestation of Azrai (I haven't decided what kind of manifestation ... ), and, lo and behold, Mr. Doyle comes out with the same suggestion. It's exciting to see some of the ideas I've had being echoed by other people (I'm not trying to say these are my ideas, rather just ideas that crept into my head before I joined, only to find out other people share them. )

    As with the Seeming Strength and Score question, I was only trying to find out if there were official game stats for the Cold Rider already in existence. It'll be fun coming up with my own (and, might I say, very, very hazardous for my players....MMmmwwwaaahhhaaahahahahahahahhahahahaha haha! )

    Thanks to everyone for the information.

    Lae'Andril Rayn

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