Winning - Birthright!

[Muaadeeb]

Has anyone ever actually been crowned emperor of the Anuirean Empire in a birthright game (Table Top or PBEM)?

If yes, - how did it happen?

If not, do you think it is even possible?

[ebatalis]

Well we have approached the subject two times. On a later date of our date of our campaign around 1540 HC a boy that was from an Aerwenian lineage claimed the lineage of Roele, the claim was not well supported and several houses went out of their way to outlaw the young upstart and in that course of small scale civil war errupted. It was the hand of Gavin Tael and the power of the Sword Mage that took the boys life while the then aging Prince Darien Avan was not really supporting him and his adversary the Archduke of Boeruine was marshalling allies on the other side. In between three different fronts it was hard for the young upstart to solidify any claim and before it got large scale his ambition despite the help he may had did not came to pass. You may now have several other questions about the course of action the church, the guilds, the gods may have taken but I will tire you, I assure you though it was a good effort

Now, in the year 1578 HC we are nowdays there is a man that his lineage was questioned from the very beggining that may prove that is the very offspring of Haelyn and a young countess of Taeghian origing. This man is a player character and it is in his knowledge part of his lineage and his destiny, there are a few men who aid him but in the current state of events things have turned strange and the power players have changed as I have mentioned in another article of discussion in the forums, the chamberlain has lost its powers, the knights of the Iron Throne along with the Imperial Legion have been disbanded etc. Well the fact is that three groups fight over the campaign at the moment and we have a full of suspense resolution as it may come to it. The Player Character has in its hands the choice to come front and claim his lineage at some point or in an unfavored turn of events die and once again after one thousand years the Anuireans will pass from one era to another.

[AndrewTall]

I presume that you mean "crowned and recognised as emperor by all Anuire" - which could be a very different thing to simply being crowned!

I would say it is quite possible, if for example Avan and Boeruine sealed a peace treaty with a marriage of heirs then their child would be in with a good shot - probably after marrying a scion of the other dukedoms.

Alternatively could a puppet emperor be raised, much like Japan with an Emperor but where the power was held by the Shogun - and fought over by the great houses?

It depends a lot by the national narrative in force. If all the major houses see the empire as a real thing, or at least as a useful fiction to inspire the peasants or oppose the clergy, then it becomes much more possible for it to exist. If the dukes see the empire as a relic of a bygone age never to return then it gets much harder for the empire to be reborn.

I do think that it would probably require the Gorgon's absence - he'd work to undermine any emperor through dozens of schemes in addition to the risk of outright war, even supporters of any would-be emperor would become his prime targets.

In practice of course the game was originally designed with "yes" as the answer - the idea being that a PC could become emperor through heroism, diplomacy, and military skill - likely after defeating the Gorgon or through similar "proof of greatness", as El-Arrasi found to his cost though, being celebrated as father-of-the-nation or emperor can be a fleeting thing.

[Deathknyte]

I presume that you mean "crowned and recognised as emperor by all Anuire" - which could be a very different thing to simply being crowned!

I would say it is quite possible, if for example Avan and Boeruine sealed a peace treaty with a marriage of heirs then their child would be in with a good shot - probably after marrying a scion of the other dukedoms.

At the end of the book War this very scenario was set up. The unborn daughter of the Duchess of Boeruine was to wed the newly crowned Duke of Avan. This takes place a few years after the death of MR and the start of the breakup of the empire.

No idea if they wed or not though, I am not aware of any other books being written after that one.

For the main post, yes, I do believe it can be done. It would take a coalition of domains working together to accomplish it in my opinion though. No one man can possibly reunite the empire by himself at this date. There are too many regents who hate each other too much to allow themselves to be talked into joining with one power or another. That is why there are three main factions trying for the Iron Throne now and Diemed trying to form a fourth faction.

[AndrewTall]

At the end of the book War this very scenario was set up. The unborn daughter of the Duchess of Boeruine was to wed the newly crowned Duke of Avan. This takes place a few years after the death of MR and the start of the breakup of the empire.

I was thinking of that when I wrote, given bloodlines inbreeding amongst the upper nobility would be rife and most "named" people in the boxed set are probably related to some degree or other so union via matrimony and betrothal should be quite possible.

...There are too many regents who hate each other too much to allow themselves to be talked into joining with one power or another ...

never under-estimate the power of ambition, fear or greed - if serving an emperor gave them a path to more power, for example by eliminating rivals or protecting them against a threat - the nobles could very quickly turn towards the idea of a reunited Anuire.

[Getters]

Both my self and Arakhor have talks endless over such a subject how do you do it any way you can.

one way that seem to work ish( and i mean ish in the fact the player thought it easy to agree then fight the scores of battle mages backing the emperor)

the Chamberlain present a young boy raise in the imperial city who had the blood of Roele. Now in this the Chamberlain was the head of a very powerfully Imperial faction of Mage's most of witch scad the willy out of most of the lords and dukes and could quite easily destroy large parts of Anuire if they combined there might.

now the collage did not all was work together and all most never agree but the willing of the dukes to play along as long as the boy allow them there little power play meant the empire felt more of a empire than a group of nations with simpler goals of reunifying Anuire.

it work for a bit till most of the lords dislike the restraint they had been given and work round the Imperial faction in fact the bring out of the emperor likely did more to solidify the empire together as each grouping of allies try to maintain power and keep the mages off balance. the Imperial temple rebuilt with the sole goal of rival the Imperial collage for the right to protect the emperor.

all in all it last 8 turns in truth i did not expect the boy and the dukes to agree to any thing but thay did work it out.

[Birthright-L]

I`ve never had players get so far as to "win" the setting. I
generally focus on a much more adventure level of play in which the
domain rules to influence events. That doesn`t really lend itself to
playing out an "end game" that really is IMO beyond the scope of the
existing domain rules. That is, where the adventure level might deal
with "groups" of single digits and then 10`s of creatures or so,
domain rules deal with hundreds and thousands, "winning" BR would
require a system that deals with thousands, tens of thousands, maybe
even hundreds of thousands in order to be a workable system to
address the "empire" level of play. It could be done, just as one
could play out the adventure level of play instead of a domain level,
but it seems a but it seems like a very tough thing to portray given
the existing rules.

However, I have kind of a follow-up to the question about the
idea. If a player becomes emperor in a meaningful way (other than
just claiming the title, that is) would the campaign setting be
"over" or would it continue from there? Would there be an "empire"
level of play?

Gary

[Birthright-L]

I`ve had a theme for a BR campaign in the back of my mind for many
years now. The idea is that Cerilia is invaded by a massive army
from across the sea, led by an awnshegh (an expatriated Cerilian or
the descendent of one) whose totemic form is a Tyrannosaur. He is at
the head of a horde of sentient monsters (mostly reptile/dinosaur
based) from the other side of Aebrynis bent on pillage and
plunder. It`s not a war of conquest, but one of extermination. At
the beginning of the campaign, one of the five regions of Anuire
(probably not one of the colder ones...) has been attacked and before
the rest of Anuire can really respond is nearly wiped out. The
Brecht, Anuireans or Khinasi become the "New Masetians" of the
setting, or near enough that the campaign world is changed forever.

I mention this "Invasion!" campaign idea in this thread because one
of the themes of the campaign is that no one nation is able to deal
with the size and power of this invading army. Not even one _region_
of Cerilia can do it. In order to have a fighting chance they will
have to unite as a single force. Maybe not a single army (Deismaar
style) but at least under some sort of coordination. That could be a
ruler, a military council, or whatever the players might come up
with, but it would have to span the continent for humanity (and
demi-humanity) to survive.

I`ve put a little thought (and a few notes) into this, and so far I
imagine this whole thing as a BR supplement, or even a series of
them: "Invasion!" in which PCs must try to unite a single Cerilian
people against the attack (and fail) followed by "Conquest!" which
focuses on the attempt (and possible failure) to unite all of
Cerilia, and maybe even "Land of Ashes!" which is about the
devastation and eventual rebirth of Cerilian civilization, possibly
due to the invading army moving on or as part of one of those
classic, "a small band of rebels penetrate the unstoppable empire on
a desperate mission to strike at the one weakness of the enemy" sorts
of things.

It`s not quite "winning Birthright" in the sense that I think the
original poster meant, but it would represent an "end game" of the
campaign in at least one sense.

Of course, it would be a MASSIVE amount of work to put together, and
I`m still futzing around with "Legendary Beings 3" so I don`t see
this project happening in the near future....

Gary

[Delazar]

I came to a similar idea when I was thinking "why would a Vos accept a Khinasi Emperor? what could unite them all in one Empire?". And indeed some external threat seemed the right way to go.

Though my two main ideas for an opponent for Cerilia were:

1) An army from the Shadow World, or maybe even the Cold Rider coming to Cerilia, and uniting all the awnshegh.

2) An Empire from the Far East, based on China/Japan, with blood-abilities based on the 5 oriental elements (Exalted ftw!)

[Muaadeeb]

I like your guys's ideas on alternate threat to add the unique elements to birthright. Perhaps instead of a tyrannosaurus a Vecilaraptor (sp!).

I like the idea of the barbarian horde from and Anduria - but that would require huge amount of work creating or managing an alternate continent.

It is definitely one way to get the current BR realms united. No one likes the Gorgon but he has yet to start a, "kill them all" approach. With an invading force you just never know.