Real Role Playing

[Brian Stoner]

At 03:05 AM 6/3/97 -0700, you wrote:
>>>Something came up in my campaign yesterday I thought I'd have to pass
>>>along. The Black Baron of Roesone, being filty rich, and an avid collector
>>>of prize horseflesh (a bad combination, read on...) purchased two prize
>>>Coeranian stallions (one male, one female) for a grand total of 40 GB.
>>>Now, that's roleplaying!
>>>
>>Ahh, but does anyone know about this misappropriation of funds? A little
>>revolt may make him think about that again. :)
>>
>>- -Brian
>>
>
>
>That would be realistic - but it would not encourage good role playing.
>
I don't know, survival can be a great motivator towards role-playing. (It's
sometimes the only thing that will get my players to actually role play :) )
Rather than a simple revolt according to game mechanics, make it personal.

- -Brian

[Cec Stacey]

>
>
>
> > Something came up in my campaign yesterday I thought I'd have to pass
> > along. The Black Baron of Roesone, being filty rich, and an avid
> > collector
> > of prize horseflesh (a bad combination, read on...) purchased two
> > prize
> > Coeranian stallions (one male, one female) for a grand total of 40 GB.
> >
> > Now, that's roleplaying!
> >
> That's pretty cool.
> Now I wonder how far a PC would go to get those horses back after they
were
> stolen by the local bad guy?
> Bob V.
>
The baron was going to send them home through Osoerde, right past Ghoere.
Don't worry, I already thought about this angle...

[Cec Stacey]

>
>
> My God! 20 GB per horse? That's 40,000 Gold! You could buy a
> warship with that much cash! A good warship!
>
>
>
> Dear lord. I would have laughed and said "yeah, right," if my GM had
> said a horse was 40,000 gold. Hell, you could pay a
> mage to Wish you the perfect horse for that much! You could get a
> conjuring/summoning specialist to summon Secretariat for that much!
>

Actually, he offered 20 GB for the first one he saw. I just carried him
along with the second one. And, he is thinking about getting into ship
collecting. I wonder how much that'll cost?.....

[johnpost@umich.ed]

On Tue, 03 Jun 1997 11:43:51 -0700 bstoner@efn.org (Brian Stoner) wrote:

>At 09:25 PM 6/2/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>In a message dated 97-06-02 19:03:50 EDT, you write:
>>
>>>//stallions// (one male, one //female//) for a grand total of 40 GB.
>>
>>Anyone besides me see the REAL criminal waste of kingdom funds with
>this
>>purchase? This lord doesn't seem to know horses as well as he
>thinks...
>>
>>Rich Baker
>>Birthright Designer
>
>If I were a citizen of his realm, I'd see to it he never made such an
>error
>again. :)
>
>-Brian
>
Unfortunately, if you were in the realm you would not have much
to say in the matter. It is upto the generals and lords of the
land to keep this insane despot in check. Sedrie Bellamie? I
think he will be more than happy to rouse the rabble in protest
over this grave misuse of royal funds.

- --John

[Berendse, S.G.P.]

someone wrote:

> like a rebellion, make it personal.

I have an example of that in the campaign I play in. The local
(coeranys) law enforcer is one of our players, the only fighter in
the group. At one time he got a 'random' event dealt by the DM, a
fued. Fueds are always fun to roleplay and they are actually quite a
gould measure in how far the general population likes you when you
settle the matter. This regent had a problem on his hands already,
though, which I had given him. I as a guilder would like to get all
the guildholding levels in this one province, in which later the
fued broke out. In order to do so, I had used several intrigue and
espionage actions, and he got it right on his plate: the other guild
(which I like to be kicked out) was reported, by his personal
secretary, that they engaged in several illicit actions. First of all
tax evasion and general misdemeanors (like not an accurate
bookkeeping which was about to be inspected etc). He didn't react to
those allegations, so I aggreviated it a bit by putting stolen things
in the inbound caravans. So the inhabitants of Caudraight saw their
recently stolen items for sale on the market by this guild. They were
none to pleased and started rioting against the guild (shops smashed
you know ho it works). The ruler had to quiet things down, but he got
a fued also, and only one action left, so he had to choose. He chose
(by using the charming abilities of the local mage, also a PC in our
group who was hired by me) to take on the guild and take a roll on
the fued. Be bogged -> he was put out of his palace by the rioting
fractions, his rooms turned into a pigstall, his police harrased and
trown into the river etc., He didn't like it a bit, he had to flee
the province for some time. Nice to bring things to the PC's home,
don't you think?
Sebastiaan

S.G.P. Berendse
E-Mail: 148530@STUDENT.FBK.EUR.NL

There is a world just around the corner of your mind
where reality is an intruder and dreams come true.
You may escape into it at will, you need no secret password,
magic wand or Alladins Lamp, all you need is your own imagination...

[trevor]

Brian Stoner wrote:
>
> At 09:25 PM 6/2/97 -0400, you wrote:
> >In a message dated 97-06-02 19:03:50 EDT, you write:
> >
> >>//stallions// (one male, one //female//) for a grand total of 40 GB.
> >
> >Anyone besides me see the REAL criminal waste of kingdom funds with this
> >purchase? This lord doesn't seem to know horses as well as he thinks...
> >
> >Rich Baker
> >Birthright Designer
>
> If I were a citizen of his realm, I'd see to it he never made such an error
> again. :)
>
> -Brian
>


Brian,

I think you are confusing modern views of
reponsible government, with the reality of medieval
polotics. There are hundreds of examples of rulers
spending exuburant amounts of money of personal
persuits. It is their inability to rule well that
removes the medieval ruler from his throne not his
spending habits. If the realm is at peace and there
is food on every plate, the average peasant is
happy, Most of them don't have the education to
understand anything about realm finances let alone
whether there hard earned money is being wasted.

I was the player who spent the 40 gbs and I did it
as statement of the charcaters feeling of security.
He rules quite well( Roesone now spans 8 provnces
and has as vassal Medoere) and is a premier general
of his day. Sure , based on our 20 century views,
it seems wasteful, it is, but to the Baron the
money is his, by divine right, and if the realm is
secure why not. Also he has just spent 10 gbs the
turn before on a festival(Sword and Crown) so the
people are pretty happy.

My 2 cents.


Trevor

[Gregoire Alexandre Segui]

At 10:05 AM 6/4/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Brian Stoner wrote:
> If I were a citizen of his realm, I'd see to it he never made such an error
> again. :)
>
> ---Brian
>
>Brian,
>
>I think you are confusing modern views of
>reponsible government, with the reality of medieval
>polotics. There are hundreds of examples of rulers
>spending exuburant amounts of money of personal
>persuits. It is their inability to rule well that
>removes the medieval ruler from his throne not his
>spending habits.

I do agrea with you Trever that rulers do as they wish with money and the
normal pesents will overlook any over indulgence with compassion as long as
they are fed and not over taxed.

This is what I love about Birthright. You have the opposit hand. While
pesents are easealy kept happy with wheat and milk, aristocracy aren't kept
so meek. Lords and vassels that are adept at court intrigue can easily
rouse the knights of a relm against an overspending ruler, wether it is
horses or festivals.

I am not saying that Trever is not doing a good job with his nobles and
knights of his kindoms, but I am merely stating that I love Birthright
because you always have another dimention to look at. when it's not
peasents, it's robbers, when its not robbers, it's monster invasions, then
rivalry, then other kingdoms, rulers, generals,...

Even a ruler who has a province with, let's say 5 units (small) that he
bought and payed for can get overthrown by a lord who promises to spend
more money on them. A cunning NPC can easely promise the entire coffers
five times over to win army and lord support.

Again, this is not to say that these may be problems in this case.

Greg.

[Brian Stoner]

At 10:05 AM 6/4/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Brian Stoner wrote:
>> >
>> >>//stallions// (one male, one //female//) for a grand total of 40 GB.
>> >
>> >Anyone besides me see the REAL criminal waste of kingdom funds with this
>> >purchase? This lord doesn't seem to know horses as well as he thinks...
>> >
>> >Rich Baker
>> >Birthright Designer
>>
>> If I were a citizen of his realm, I'd see to it he never made such an error
>> again. :)
>>
>> -Brian
>>
>
>
>Brian,
>
>I think you are confusing modern views of
>reponsible government, with the reality of medieval
>polotics. There are hundreds of examples of rulers
>spending exuburant amounts of money of personal
>persuits. It is their inability to rule well that
>removes the medieval ruler from his throne not his
>spending habits. If the realm is at peace and there
>is food on every plate, the average peasant is
>happy, Most of them don't have the education to
>understand anything about realm finances let alone
>whether there hard earned money is being wasted.
>
>I was the player who spent the 40 gbs and I did it
>as statement of the charcaters feeling of security.
>He rules quite well( Roesone now spans 8 provnces
>and has as vassal Medoere) and is a premier general
>of his day. Sure , based on our 20 century views,
>it seems wasteful, it is, but to the Baron the
>money is his, by divine right, and if the realm is
>secure why not. Also he has just spent 10 gbs the
>turn before on a festival(Sword and Crown) so the
>people are pretty happy.
>
>My 2 cents.
>
>
>Trevor

Granted, a feeling of security can lead one to make such decisions. And, I
should have said that I would be a player character, not just a citizen. Of
course My character would have to figure out a way through the security. I
just feel that using money in such a way is not right, even in a medieval
setting, where it is accepted. Perhaps the people are well fed and the
nation is secure., but I still see little justification. I do think it was
great roll playing, and I would have given you XPs for it. However, my
character would likely see it completely different. I should qualify my
statement, however. I usually play members of the military, so it would be
amtter of disloyalty for one to oppose the action of the Baron. That would
be one of the few things stopping me (if I knew about it). That and the
strength of the security around the Baron. :)

- -Brian

[dsbrown@is2.dal.c]

> Has anyone else run their parties, or been in a party, that went through
> one of the published adventures? I'd like to hear some input on how they
> went. IMNSHO, they're some of the best adventures I've seen written in
> years.

I have to agree.I've run my players through all of the published
adventures (including a good number from the Legends book), and I
have found them all to be excellent. I have had to alter various
aspects of the modules (I found them to be relatively unchallenging
combat wise for the party levels listed, and my boys didn't really
have all that much by way of cool gear). I will admit that I had to
read The Sword of Roele several times before I felt comfortable
understanding everything, let alone running it. ( Actually,
afterwards, I had a great time...one of the PCs managed to lose 4
characters in it..the rest made out ok...you'd think he's learn not
to wander off by himself so much, wouldn't you? :) )

Sean

[Cec Stacey]

>
> But the character was not only a horse lover, he's also a regent, a
baron, is he a poor
> one or he fight against his conscience to buy the horse. Does he feel a
bad taste for
> having spent such a lot of money, public money, for something he only
wants?
> To be a great role play act it must be at least a hard decision. If the
regent was a
> lawful one. How went the things?
>
> --
Things really haven't gone anywhere. This was an aside to the adventure
"Sword of Roele", and the party was travelling to the Chimaeron via
Coeranys. To note, though, the aforementioned Baron was the only survivor
of the adventure, stumbling into the light alone carrying the two pieces of
Michael's sword. Would have been a very climatic campaign ending, but the
players pestered me to continue for another week.

Has anyone else run their parties, or been in a party, that went through
one of the published adventures? I'd like to hear some input on how they
went. IMNSHO, they're some of the best adventures I've seen written in
years.


BTW Rich B., if my innocent comment about the "female stallion" (actually I
said "two stallions, one male one female", just to explain myself) gave you
a laugh, then when you divide everything down to the common denominator, at
least you were entertained. And that's the goal of the game, right?