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  1. #21
    L.Willett
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    >Hate to do this:
    >
    >Fire: Underwater volcanos and active magma, plate tectonics and the like
    >Earth: The ocean floor
    >Water: The countless gallons of sea-water
    >Air: Magma breaks apart the H2O atoms in water, mixing with soil
    >nutrients, and so a sort of "air" bubbles up from happenstances of "fire"
    >
    >All 4 elements in relative proximity....

    Well, fish breath in water, too... (unless its stale, of course).
    I'm not sure that this amount of air would be enough to make the
    difference, esp. if you continue the 'science' of the historical period.
    Water was made up of one element...
    -

  2. #22
    Nadastor
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    At 00.18 28/05/97 -0700, you wrote:
    >> on land: Sun=Fire, Earth=Earth, Rain=Water, and the Sky=Air. Beneath the
    >> oceans seldomn if ever do more then 3 of the elements come into contact,
    >so
    >> they do not become points at which the Mebbhail(sp?)can be drained from
    >the
    >> land. Its not perfect reasoning, but it works well enough to keep
    >undersea
    >> Regents for disrupting your game.
    >
    >
    >Hate to do this:
    >
    >Fire: Underwater volcanos and active magma, plate tectonics and the like
    >Earth: The ocean floor
    >Water: The countless gallons of sea-water
    >Air: Magma breaks apart the H2O atoms in water, mixing with soil
    >nutrients, and so a sort of "air" bubbles up from happenstances of "fire"
    >
    >All 4 elements in relative proximity....
    >
    >:)
    >
    >Zero


    So, if this goes when can say that yes the oceans are great source of magic
    but that only in some interesting volcanos sites.
    It seems quite good, so we can explain some other things, it's easy that
    nobody found this in the past, so it's why nobody know about this, and we
    can create some new communities near volcanos without having to populate the
    entire ocean.

    Rich said that maybe we found what really happened to Masetians ?

    What we exactly know about Masetians ?

    Nadastor, Wizard of the Black Robes
    "The power of a man is not in his hands, but in his eyes !
    His life is not into his body, but into his mind !
    The world is not around him, but is in him !"

  3. #23
    JOHN RICKARDS
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    > Hate to do this:
    >
    > Fire: Underwater volcanos and active magma, plate tectonics and the like
    > Earth: The ocean floor
    > Water: The countless gallons of sea-water
    > Air: Magma breaks apart the H2O atoms in water, mixing with soil
    > nutrients, and so a sort of "air" bubbles up from happenstances of "fire"
    >
    > All 4 elements in relative proximity....
    >
    > :)
    >
    > Zero

    Mind you, that's only in a volcanic or seismically-active region.
    Good point, though.


    John Rickards

    "He who is looking for something has lost something."
    "And he who is not looking?"
    "He gets run over."



    PS. Dan. Hahahahaha.

  4. #24
    Perceval
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    zero wrote:

    > As it is, undersea bloodlines (absolutely necessary for realm magic,
    > not even elves can cast realm magic without a bloodline (unless you wanna
    > change the rules, cool...))

    I think elves can cast realm magic without a bloodline. Humans without a
    bloodline can only cast lesser magic.

    Olivier

  5. #25
    Finnsson
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    Couldn't anyone write down a summary of this subject later (after you
    have finished the discussion)? That would be great!
    The reason is that I'm to lazy to read all the posts about the subject
    (I got about 100 messages when I come home).

    //Finnsson

  6. #26
    Dustin Evermore
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    zero wrote:
    >> on land: Sun=Fire, Earth=Earth, Rain=Water, and the Sky=Air. Beneath
    the
    >> oceans seldomn if ever do more then 3 of the elements come into
    contact,
    >so
    >> they do not become points at which the Mebbhail(sp?)can be drained
    from
    >the
    >> land. Its not perfect reasoning, but it works well enough to keep
    >undersea
    >> Regents for disrupting your game.
    >
    >
    >Hate to do this:
    >
    >Fire: Underwater volcanos and active magma, plate tectonics and the
    like
    >Earth: The ocean floor
    >Water: The countless gallons of sea-water
    >Air: Magma breaks apart the H2O atoms in water, mixing with soil
    >nutrients, and so a sort of "air" bubbles up from happenstances of
    "fire"
    >
    >All 4 elements in relative proximity....
    >
    >:)
    >

    Good ideas, both. How about this: When a wizard seeks out a Source he
    must "tune" himself to it in addition to simply finding its location. The
    more in "tune" he is, the higher the Source level, up to the max allowed
    by the rating of the province or amount of mebheil (sp) available. Since
    most wizards are of land-based races, then you might rule that they cannot
    get in "tune" with possible underwater sources. I think this is what I'm
    going to go with if it comes up in my game.

    D. Evermore

  7. #27
    Nadastor
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    At 18.45 28/05/97 +0200, you wrote:
    >zero wrote:
    >
    >> As it is, undersea bloodlines (absolutely necessary for realm magic,
    >> not even elves can cast realm magic without a bloodline (unless you wanna
    >> change the rules, cool...))
    >
    >I think elves can cast realm magic without a bloodline. Humans without a
    >bloodline can only cast lesser magic.
    >
    >Olivier
    >

    Why do you suppose that ?

    Nadastor, Wizard of the Black Robes
    "The power of a man is not in his hands, but in his eyes !
    His life is not into his body, but into his mind !
    The world is not around him, but is in him !"

  8. #28
    Nadastor
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    Finally I came to this:

    The mebhaighl isn't explained in greater detail so that we can say from what
    it come.
    It's not simply an union among the elements cause this doesn't explain why
    in forest there is more mebhaighl than in a city. But we can assume that for
    having mebhaighl there must be some conditions.
    In general the ocean doesn't have such conditions, so we solve the balance
    problem (costal provinces vs. inner ones), the history problem (why wizards
    haven't used that mebhaighl before ?), the good-sense problem (Really
    populate Aebrynis with a lot of strange intellingent races underwater, with
    great underwater mages everywhere in oceans and armies and guild and fondal
    caravans and all stuff upside-down cause the objects go up instead of down
    and so on, it seems to me that means missing the point) and finally the
    nine-sources-too-powerful-for-us-poor-DMs problem.

    But after these discussions about sources and seas i cannot simply state
    that there must be conditions that in oceans aren't.

    We can add flavor to the campaign, without falling in those problems,
    assuming that in a few sites in the ocean the sea is really full of
    mebhaighl, maybe we can state that these sites are near volcanos, but we can
    also chose another rare ocean feature. After this it goes alone that those
    are extremely powerful sources and that are extremely difficult to tap too.

    I'm saying that others solutions too strange and too missguiding aren't good
    for my taste, but there's a point that hits me in a particular way, the
    Masetians clue that Rich throws in the hole...


    Nadastor, Wizard of the Black Robes
    "The power of a man is not in his hands, but in his eyes !
    His life is not into his body, but into his mind !
    The world is not around him, but is in him !"

  9. #29
    Vestrii@aol.co
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    In a message dated 97-05-28 05:42:23 EDT, you write:

    > Would the wizard have to be _underwater_ to cast the spells, or just _on_
    > the water? Even if this particular wizard had to remain underwater, he
    > could do so for an indefinite period of time (I believe, no book handy...
    > oops if I'm wrong here...)

    That's what Ley lines are for :)

    Dave

  10. #30
    Undertaker
    Guest

    Sources and the Seas

    At 12:18 AM 5/28/97 -0700, Zero(zero@wiredweb.com)wrote:
    >
    >Hate to do this:
    >
    >Fire: Underwater volcanos and active magma, plate tectonics and the like
    >Earth: The ocean floor
    >Water: The countless gallons of sea-water
    >Air: Magma breaks apart the H2O atoms in water, mixing with soil
    >nutrients, and so a sort of "air" bubbles up from happenstances of "fire"
    >
    >All 4 elements in relative proximity....
    >
    >:)
    >
    >

    Nice try, I even had a PC suggest this. And I can grant the first 3, but not
    Air. For purposes of fantasy magic I don't allow for "atomic" or other
    semi-scientific explanations to be twisted in. Magic is too powerful to let
    PCs use a couple of science based facts to get thier way. It must be more
    primal. To this end I would agree that certain conditions could create
    temporary Sources on the surface of the ocean(ie. waterspouts, hurricanes,
    etc.)but these would be dangerous to tap, and too fleeting. You could also
    say that the ocean itself is a possibly one huge Source. The ocean(Water)
    rests on the seafloor(Earth) while the wind(Air) creates waves, and the
    sun(Fire) burns across its surface. To this I answer: The ocean is in
    constant motion, and only the first few feet of water would be eligible for
    Mebbhail(sp?). But because of the currents the empowered water is constanly
    diluted, as water is drawn away from the area of enchantment, and it slowly
    loses its power.

    Now this still leaves an opening for a Mage to gain some Source power from
    the sea but makes it a greater task to get, and you can always have the
    Source level rise or drop depending on your need. Just remember if your
    going to use sea Sources other creatures or possibly lost civilizations
    should already be using these. Prehaps an Ershliegn(sp?) or two use this
    power. Or a tribe of Tritons from another plane who are using the power of
    Cerilia's oceans for some secret task. An aquatic Dragon might be good here
    too. No matter what you do don't let your PCs walk in and claim a tremendous
    amount of power uncontested, just because they think they found a loophole.
    Its important to have fun, but take this slowly so you don't unknowingly
    throw your game out of balance.

    Undertaker, richt@metrolink.net

    "War is a matter of vital importance to the State;
    the province of life or death;
    the road to survival or ruin.
    It is mandatory that it be thoroughly studied."
    -Sun Tzu,(The Art of War)-

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