IM> The last games they owned they made better (Ars Magics and Talislanta
>I believe). They were just making too much $$$ on Magic and having too
>much fun doing it.

Yes but seriously, WHO was buying these products? I don't know a
single person that bought them before or after the buyout.

>I think it would have been better if it was for 1st edition
>(or Basic D&D). I am a devout 1st ed'er and 'dislike intensly' 2nd
>Obviously, 2nd ed 'extras' (non- PHB, DMG, MM) were all nails in the
>coffin, so to speak. Now, 2nd ed does have some great stuff (initiative
>system comes to mind, organizing, and....hmmm. Nope. Thats it.).

What? 1st Edition s*cks in comparison to 2nd Edition and I'll tell you

Fighters: 1st Edition; Fighters began with no specialization and were
pretty bland initially. Then when specialization
came out in Unburped Arcana it was way out of
hand with the potential to "super specialize"
having a +3, +3 bonus with a weapon.
2nd Edition; Fighters now begin with a +1, +2 specialization
bonus and have their attack rate raised. I truly
think this has given the fighter his due and I
for one have witnessed a dramatic decrease in
min/maxing and players trying to cheat on their
percentile strength rolls.
Paladins: No real change
Rangers: 1st Edition; You think 2nd Edition has munchkin rules but
approve of a Ranger having 2-16 hit points at
first level? Now thats a munchkin rule if I ever
saw one. Not to mention the +1 to damage/level
a ranger gets against giants. I think
realistically any giant in 1st Edition that sees
a ranger would be wise to run screaming in the
other direction.
2nd Edition; Here the ranger can fight with two weapons with
no penalty (which they took from Drizzt Do'
Urden of course). Has good relations with
wildlife and can choose a bonus to hit against
a specific monster type. Much more toned down
and not as prone to Munchkinism. Also replacing
the surprise rules with Hide in Shadows/ Move
Silently. My gaming group is much more
comfortable with this.
Wizards: 1st Edition; No real problems with the 1st Edition
2nd Edition; Added the Specialists (Which makes a whole lot
of sense to me). Cleaned up the spell
descriptions. But I will give you this, the
stone skin spell gets a little out of hand.
Priests: 1st Edition; Again unrealistically limiting. I mean a cleric
of Odin choosing a mace over a spear? Get real.
Its just plain silly in my opinion for clerics
of all pantheons having the same powers.
Thats like saying Hindu's and Christians would
have the same powers. Can't see a Hindu wielding
a morning star and wearing Plate armor, sorry.
2nd Edition; Priests are more limited in "spheres of
influence" but gain granted powers. I see this
as adding much more diversity in the priest
class. Not to mention they aren't limited to
blunt weapons. Also they still let you play the
generic cleric if you want.
Theives 1st Edition; I really hated that table with the thieving
abilities on it. I have always seen thieves as
having versatile personalities like merchants
and locksmiths but 1st Edition didn't support
2nd Edition; Now with 2nd Edition you can be a specialist
in picking locks OR picking pockets. You no
longer have to rely on the type of race you
* A quick word about the Assassin. Isn't the
backstab ability enough? Do we really need a
class that can automatically kill characters?*
Bards 1st Edition; The original munchkin rule in my opinion. I've
heard tales of people rising to 1st Edition Bard
and then becoming mages. Now thats being a
2nd Edition; Thank god they turned the Bard into an
entertainer/wise man instead of an overblown
Initiative The only thing you like about 2nd Edition, the
only thing I hate. It takes sooooo long.
Nails in the Coffin; Yes and no. If they would have just left well
enough alone without coming out with new covers
and the New Options books I think things would
have been ok. Of course by the time 1st Edition
came around, those of us with the Basic AD&D set
were already tired of buying new books anyway.
If they had just continued to print 1st and 2nd
Edition (giving both supporters a choice) they would
have been much better off. But to be honest, if
2nd Edition had never come out, I wouldn't have missed

> And I really do like Birthright (and the concept behind Dark
(Continued to next message)

* 1st 2.00 #9097 * Hope for the best, plan for the worst.