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Thread: Powers
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01-27-1999, 11:34 AM #11Jim CooperGuest
Powers
Jeremy Baker wrote:
> Where did you get these figures from? (They seem quite precise for them to be random.) And what do you mean exactly by 'bloodpower' and
> 'bloodstrength', are you refering to bloodline power of regents in the same way? ie. The Gorgon and Micheal Roele are/were demi-gods by this system.<
The worst place - my head! ;D And yes, you got the second part right,
too - I figure that the power of the gods and the divine blood in
mortals is exactly the same; the only difference being, of course, that
the gods got a lot more of it (in the neighbourhood, I've decided,
around 1500 points).
Its the only way I figure will explain people like The Serpent, Azrai
(ala Cold Rider), without added a pletheora of new Cerilian powers.
Does anyone have a different view?
Cheers,
Darren
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01-27-1999, 02:03 PM #12Pieter SleijpenGuest
Powers
I am one of those people that likes the TSR line, that powers of the
Gods come from their worshippers. I also believe that the actions are
also some form of devotion (I use the piety system from an article from
the Dragon magazine) and indeed that caranage strengthens Belinik, even
when done by a worshipper of Haelyn. In Greatheart it is suggested that
Azrai was so strong, because the fear and hatred of the people on the
battle of Deismar strengthened him. These emotions would have been in
his sphere of influence, suggesting that TSR also thinks along these
lines (or at least the writer of Greatheart).
Several of the discussions on this mailing list, also made me believe
that temple holdings do not nessecary reflect faith of the people. But
more there material power over the people. Avani might have les holdings
then Haelyn, but she is actually worshiped in every other culture.
Something Erik can not say (the Khinasi never heard of him, even not as
the husband of Avani, Rilni has got his portofolio in this area). Kirche
is very structured faith, because it is militaristic and because nobles
tend to worship him. No farmer, trader or craftsman is going to worship
Kirche, except to keep him as far away as possible!
The idea that the childeren of the deities would have reduced the power
of their parents does not fit in the bloodline thinking. Blooded
characters do not loose bloodpoints if they get childeren, so why should
deities? The original reason these people became gods, might have been
because of the bloodline, but worship is in my opinion more important.
It will be easier though to ascend to godhood for high blooded
characters. Normaly a god-patron is needed for the assension, now this
is not required.
Pieter Sleijpen
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01-27-1999, 02:14 PM #13Kai BesteGuest
Powers
> If anyone wants it, and if I can find the time to actually sit down
> and type it out, I will post it here.
Yes, do post it.
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01-27-1999, 02:43 PM #14
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Powers
> I am one of those people that likes the TSR line, that powers of the
> Gods come from their worshippers. I also believe that the actions are
> also some form of devotion (I use the piety system from an article from
> the Dragon magazine) and indeed that caranage strengthens Belinik, even
> when done by a worshipper of Haelyn. In Greatheart it is suggested that
> Azrai was so strong, because the fear and hatred of the people on the
> battle of Deismar strengthened him. These emotions would have been in
> his sphere of influence, suggesting that TSR also thinks along these
> lines (or at least the writer of Greatheart).
And don't forget offerings and sacrifices. Surely these give the deities
power as well. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense. Why try to appease a
god with an offering when it doesn't do him any good anyways. Of course,
the offering in question must be of right type - you wouldn't want to
offend the god by doing something that's against everything what he stands
for. In the same light, you can dedicate an upcoming major battle to
Haelyn and just hope that god will smile upon you because of the little
shred of power you just gave him. Or you can call it a wholesale
slaughter and dedicate it to Belinik - it just depends on what kinda of
person you are.
- the Falcon
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01-27-1999, 04:51 PM #15Victor VogtGuest
Powers
Yes, I no! Other than I just made a complete fool of myself to e-mail the
wrong board. I also did it in a combined e-mail. It wasn't the BR list it
was the either the Alternity or the Stardrive lists. I don't remember
which. I do apologize once again. ~sigh~
VV
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jim Cooper
To: birthright@MPGN.COM
Date: Tuesday, January 26, 1999 6:09 PM
Subject: Re: [BIRTHRIGHT] - Powers
>Victor Vogt wrote:
>> Come on people lets talk about the game. What is this
>> [Fluff] everybody seems to be filling up the message boards with?<
>
>What do you mean by fluff? I haven't seen any frivolous posts on this
>list ...
>
>Cheers,
>Darren
>
>
>************************************************* **************************
>>'unsubscribe birthright' as the body of the message.
>
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01-28-1999, 12:21 AM #16Jim CooperGuest
Powers
Pieter Sleijpen wrote:
> The idea that the childeren of the deities would have reduced the power of their parents does not fit in the bloodline thinking. Blooded
> characters do not loose bloodpoints if they get childeren, so why should deities? The original reason these people became gods, might have been because of the bloodline, but worship is in my opinion more important. It will be easier though to ascend to godhood for high blooded characters. Normaly a god-patron is needed for the assension, now this is not required.<
Indeed, just as mortal regents, gods would be nothing but ultra powerful
essences without worshippers (holdings). In a way, however, it does fit
in with the bloodline thinking. Apparently, according to the rules,
children get an average of their parents bloodline scores. Considering
that the source of bloodpower resides mostly within the existing gods,
where else would it come from? I don't think Aebrynis just creates
bloodpower outta thin air - hence, it had to come from somewhere and, to
my reasoning, the gods gave a portion of themselves to create a new
entity seems highly appropriate. The only other thing is that they
would have to rip it outta a few tens of thousands of mortals - not
exactly a 'good' act. If gods can come into existence just by the
number of worshippers that believe in them, then that undercuts the
whole BR milieu.
You know what bothers me the most? JUST WHY THE HECK DON'T KRIESHA AND
BELINIK HAVE ANY CHILDREN?!?!? What's up with that, Ed? Why? WHY?!?
I just can't figure out the reasoning behind this!!!!! ARRGGGHHH!
Sorry. Its been bottled up inside me so long, I just had to let
it out ...
But your also right, and hit the nail on the head on something that has
been bothering me for a long time - just how is bloodpower propagated?
I haven't satisfactorily answered why children don't take a part of
their parents' essences when they are born. Does bloodpower multiply
over time? I have always held to the firm belief that bloodpower is a
_finite_ quantity within Aebrynis - and thanks to Tim "the Studly Man"
Nutting, and my newfound enlightenment, I now reason that children -
indeed, ALL blooded people - in fact receive their bloodpower from the
(limited) wellsprings that reside within Aebrynis itself.
Its a good DM ruling, that. Allows me to mess with my players even
more! MwuHAHAHAHAAHAAAAAAAA! Whose to say you got your father's or
mother's good bloodline and not Azrai's ....
Cheers,
Darren :D
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01-28-1999, 12:33 AM #17Jim CooperGuest
Powers
the Falcon wrote:
> And don't forget offerings and sacrifices. Surely these give the deities power as well. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense. Why try to appease a god with an offering when it doesn't do him any good anyways.<
Who is to say that anything the gods demand of their worshippers really
is necessary? What if its all one big lie, the one certainty being that
the New Gods know, without a doubt, that if no one believes in them,
they risk an eternity of loneliness and solitude? Yet, make them
believe in a lie, and they will hold it as the One Truth, willing to die
for you, for The Truth. (Can anyone tell I watch the X-Files?) Doesn't
this sound familiar? Organized religion has been making us believe for
many, many millenia ...
IMBR world, the gods aren't all that noble - in fact, they are just as
human as any other mortal that worships them ... and have exactly the
same wants, desires, and need for companionship as any other person.
(Haelyn: "Yea, yea, but Nesirie is ALWAYS mopping around! I wouldn't
mind at least a chat every ONCE in a while ..." Man, all we did was
just that once! I gotta start cruising Aebrynis ...") :D
Can anyone say Zeus & Hercules, or even good 'ol studly Jupiter?!? :D
Thats exactly how I picture Cuiraecen and Haelyn ... Father and son,
looking for some nice mortal ***!
(Okay - I got a little carried away ...)
Cheers,
Darren
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01-28-1999, 03:39 PM #18
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> You know what bothers me the most? JUST WHY THE HECK DON'T KRIESHA AND
> BELINIK HAVE ANY CHILDREN?!?!? What's up with that, Ed? Why? WHY?!?
> I just can't figure out the reasoning behind this!!!!! ARRGGGHHH!
Perhaps they just don't like to share? :)
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01-28-1999, 03:42 PM #19
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Powers
> Who is to say that anything the gods demand of their worshippers really
> is necessary? What if its all one big lie, the one certainty being that
Of course, there have always been gods around who made their followers do
things completely unnecessary. However, those gods seem to have a marked
tendency of either never increasing in power, or already being
all-powerful (or at least thinking they are). If you're a smart (and
sane) god, you'll let your followers do things that are good for you and
discourage them from doing otherwise.
- the Falcon
************************************************** *****************************
* *
* "You got a bullet in your head" -- Z. de la Rocha *
* *
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01-28-1999, 09:49 PM #20Jim CooperGuest
Powers
the Falcon wrote:
> Perhaps they just don't like to share? :) <
Heh. Point, but I always thought they would just TAKE from each other -
a piece here, a piece there, no big deal! :D (Actually, I can't shake
the feeling that Belinik really is just a coward at heart, and Kriesha
would be the dominant partner in this 'relationship' ...)
Cheers,
I better not put my name to this one (I'm getting bad, aren't I?)
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