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  1. #1

    Province Sizes (was Castle Leve

    > I get very local in BR, dealing having players get close to a provincial
    > ruler such as the count of Bellam in Roesone. how does the count operate?
    > Does he collect RP's and what is his income like? When one starts looking
    > at translating the BR system to a historical map, as I mentioned, one gets
    > the same questions. The feudal system has three levels, which over time get
    > inter-mixed and more confusing, but cleanly, there are three levels:
    > king/emperor, overlords, and lords who have only peasants (or a few knights)
    > as subjects.

    In my current campaign I started the group in Bellam, with one of the
    characters as Count. I more or less ignored RP et al., figuring
    firstly that most taxes would go to the Crown (which also neatly
    sidestepped the problem of domain maintenance, since the Crown would
    cover that too). I skipped RPs too, figuring that, for example, if
    the Baroness sends a message to the Count:
    "I want you to prevent Orthien Tane from conducting his business in
    your county. See to it, using any means at your disposal."
    [Contest action: Roesone vs. Orthien Tane's holdings in Bellam] then
    she will be using her RPs as any PC ruler would, but that the players
    were now at the 'thin end of the wedge' and actually performing the
    nitty-gritty summarised as the Contest action.

    If the Count took any action on his own initiative, he would be going
    up against the local representatives of, say, Orthien Tane, who would
    likewise have no RP, etc., to call their own. The players had more
    or less the same set of actions, problems etc. as they would running
    on a less local level, but their problems, and resources, were that
    much smaller. Having everything on a local level meant that
    everything was dealt with personally (by at least one of the party,
    which also included the Sheriff and Under-Sheriff of Bellam amongst
    its number).

    All told, the system worked very well. Anything big which came up
    was reported to the Baroness, and she issued instructions. In
    essence, whenever the group faced problems beyond their local sphere
    of influence, they served to act-out the domain actions of the
    Baroness as she ordered.

    John.

    "Once I was a lamb, playing in a green field. Then
    the wolves came. Now I am an eagle and I fly in a
    different universe."
    "And now you kill the lambs," whispered Dardalion.
    "No, priest. No one pays for lambs."
    - David Gemmel, Waylander

  2. #2
    Kenneth Gauck
    Guest

    Province Sizes (was Castle Leve

    On Thursday, Jan 14, Ben wrote:


    > Remember the provinces in BR are very small areas of land. (The
    Gorgon's
    >Crown is only about the size of Ohio.)

    I have made a map of France based on BR province sizes. The duchy of
    Normandie has 14 provinces, as compared to 9 in the principality of Avanil.
    Bretagne (Brittany) has 16 less well developed provinces. The duc de
    Bretagne has four principle vassals (two branches of the House of Rohan, de
    Guesclin, and his heir, the comte de Penthieve) and several lessor vassals.
    The Bretagne rules 9 provinces directly, and rules 7 as overlord.

    This brings up an interesting question which I have been working with, in
    part because I wonder how the Emperor aquired RP's when he would obviously
    need vassals, (the dukes) if only to deal with the random events. Also when
    I get very local in BR, dealing having players get close to a provincial
    ruler such as the count of Bellam in Roesone. how does the count operate?
    Does he collect RP's and what is his income like? When one starts looking
    at translating the BR system to a historical map, as I mentioned, one gets
    the same questions. The feudal system has three levels, which over time get
    inter-mixed and more confusing, but cleanly, there are three levels:
    king/emperor, overlords, and lords who have only peasants (or a few knights)
    as subjects.

    Here is my solution for those who want to deal with this situation:
    Continue to focus the game on provincial powers, at the overlord level.
    They collect RP's and GB's normally. Royals collect 1/2 the number of RP's
    for the lands they own, and collect no taxes (royals derived their incomes
    from lands where they were overlords). Lords also collect 1/2 RP's for
    their lands, and collected the full tax values as the overlords.

    So the count of Bellam gets 1.5 RP's per season (or 2 in sping and autumn,
    and 1 in summer and winter) and the same taxation as the baron of Roesone
    (d4) when you consider that he too must pay court costs his take home
    income is probably 1GB per season.

    Such as scheme has very little effect on the money situation (make those
    lords pay court costs or lose their RP's, can't let 'em forget who you are)
    but it does double the RP's in the game. So double the RP cost of
    everything. People who work well with others can get things done with the
    same ability, those who alienate their vassals find they have to get
    everything done with there own resources.

    How to complicate the business:
    Royals real power comes from being overlords. The emperor of Anuire may
    have alot of counties spread about, or a few duchies here and there, but
    that will be his powebase. The emperor would total half the RP's for lands
    in Anuire (or elsewhere) swearing loyalty plus the full value (as described
    in the rules) for places where he was overlord. Lords might come into
    direct control of law holdings (or of any holdings as a game progressed),
    they would collect RP's and GB's normally for these holdings.

    All holdings are asssumed to operate as normally. This business about three
    levels only applies to landed regents and the RP's and income derived from
    owning lands.

    Kenneth Gauck
    c558382@earthlink.net

  3. #3
    DKEvermore@aol.co
    Guest

    Province Sizes (was Castle Leve

    I always pictured it a bit more simplistic.

    The local nobles under (for instance) Roesone are granted patches of land,
    which will belong to them and their family "forever". A fertile patch of land
    can keep a noble family rich for a long time. In exchange they must collect
    taxes and support the army (thus causing the low must costs in Birthright).

    They never touch regency of the land, in fact many are not even blooded.

    That's it, short and sweet
    Dustin Evermore

  4. #4

    Province Sizes (was Castle Leve

    I have been turning the local lords RP s collection over in my head for awhile
    too.

    Couldn't you just treat the Count of Bellam normally when calculating the RPS
    and his holding levels, but instead of thinking of it as a level 1 holding (on a
    national scale), consider it a level one "provincial holding"? Thus, under the
    Roesone holdings, Bellam shows no holdings, but in the Provincial holding
    charts, Bellam might have a level 2 law.

    The actual conversion from provincial to national level has yet to be figured
    out though.... perhaps there is some sort of formula hidden in the holding
    levels themselves.... i.e.. level 2 provincial holding = level 0 law holding???
    The Rp costs could also remain the same could they not, but just on a different
    scale? Imagine the cost of ruling a rural township, compared to an entire
    province... perhaps the base "RP Point" could be scaled from 1 to 10, with 10
    units being equivalent to a single "National Level" RP point (??) that we all
    use currently.

    I haven't thought this out very far (which may be obvious), so if you see any
    holes or reasons why this wouldn't work, please feel free to point them out.
    (Which I am sure you all would anyway) ;)

    Keith
    - --
    "I hate it when my brain stem hurts."
    The New Draftmine Repository:
    http://members.home.net/morgramen/index.html

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