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  1. #1
    tduexx@students.aabc.d
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    First of all,I think this is a question which can only be answered by the
    local DM. BUT my oppinion is :

    As far as I remember, the magician has full access to the Illusion/Phantasm
    and Divination schools, and level 1 and 2 access to all others.
    If I am wrong, the following should be ignored completely, since I am
    writing it on the assumption that the above is true.

    Here goes:

    A magician who is blooded (whether he starts out as blooded or becomes
    blooded during the campaign is in my book completely irrelevant) can collect
    RP and can cast realm magic AS LONG as the realm spell in question is within
    his school access. That is below level 3 for all other schools than Illusion
    and Divination. Each realm spell has a 'level' of sorts, use it to determine
    if the magician can cast the spell.

    He will not be the terrifying force a guy like Aelis is, but still, any
    magic-wielding person with access to realm magic is a force to be recogned
    with.

    Thomas

  2. #2
    Rasmus Juul Wagner
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    tduexx@students.aabc.dk wrote:
    >
    > First of all,I think this is a question which can only be answered by the
    > local DM. BUT my oppinion is :
    >
    > As far as I remember, the magician has full access to the Illusion/Phantasm
    > and Divination schools, and level 1 and 2 access to all others.
    > If I am wrong, the following should be ignored completely, since I am
    > writing it on the assumption that the above is true.
    >
    > Here goes:
    >
    > A magician who is blooded (whether he starts out as blooded or becomes
    > blooded during the campaign is in my book completely irrelevant) can collect
    > RP and can cast realm magic AS LONG as the realm spell in question is within
    > his school access. That is below level 3 for all other schools than Illusion
    > and Divination. Each realm spell has a 'level' of sorts, use it to determine
    > if the magician can cast the spell.
    >
    > He will not be the terrifying force a guy like Aelis is, but still, any
    > magic-wielding person with access to realm magic is a force to be recogned
    > with.

    I disagree. A magician has chosen an easier road to magical power than
    the wizard's, and does not have the command of magical forces necessary
    to cast realm spells. And I do believe the rulebook is quite clear on
    the subject. Not that I'm a slave to the ruelbook, but I just needed
    something to back my point :-)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    "Preemptive Retribution"

    Rasmus Juul Wagner
    Technical University of Denmark
    c958650@student.dtu.dk
    www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Stadium/7859
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

  3. #3
    Gary V. Foss
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    Rasmus Juul Wagner wrote:

    > tduexx@students.aabc.dk wrote:
    > >
    > > First of all,I think this is a question which can only be answered by the
    > > local DM. BUT my oppinion is :
    > >
    > > As far as I remember, the magician has full access to the Illusion/Phantasm
    > > and Divination schools, and level 1 and 2 access to all others.
    > > If I am wrong, the following should be ignored completely, since I am
    > > writing it on the assumption that the above is true.
    > >
    > > A magician who is blooded (whether he starts out as blooded or becomes
    > > blooded during the campaign is in my book completely irrelevant) can collect
    > > RP and can cast realm magic AS LONG as the realm spell in question is within
    > > his school access. That is below level 3 for all other schools than Illusion
    > > and Divination. Each realm spell has a 'level' of sorts, use it to determine
    > > if the magician can cast the spell.
    > >
    > > He will not be the terrifying force a guy like Aelis is, but still, any
    > > magic-wielding person with access to realm magic is a force to be recogned
    > > with.
    >
    > I disagree. A magician has chosen an easier road to magical power than
    > the wizard's, and does not have the command of magical forces necessary
    > to cast realm spells. And I do believe the rulebook is quite clear on
    > the subject. Not that I'm a slave to the ruelbook, but I just needed
    > something to back my point :-)

    Well, I'm going to go for something of a the middle ground here. If this ever
    comes up in a campaign I'm running (and it just might) I think I'll give the
    player the following choices:

    1. He can keep his character a magician. In this case, the character will not be
    able to cast "true" magic, nor realm spells that have a level requirement above
    3rd unless they are from the illusion/phantasm or divination schools. (Since
    magicians can cast 1st and 2nd level spells from any school I think they should be
    able to cast realm magic that is based on those lower level spells.)

    2. He can switch his character to a standard mage, illusionist or diviner and lose
    a level of experience to reflect the way that he would have to relearn a lot of
    his skills. He can keep any of his weapon proficiencies that contradict his new
    class, but cannot learn any new ones that a magician could pick up and a mage
    cannot. He can use whatever realms spells he can get his hands on and cast as
    much "true" magic as he likes.

    This might not be the most elegant way to handle the situation, but it gives a
    decent choice to the player, which I always like to do. The magician character
    class is one of the interesting things about the BR setting (and one that I don't
    see very well exploited in the published materials) but it does create a kind of
    difficult problem should the character's abilities change later on.

    - -Gary

  4. #4
    DKEvermore@aol.co
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    In a message dated 98-06-02 12:00:30 EDT, you write:

    > I disagree. A magician has chosen an easier road to magical power than
    > the wizard's, and does not have the command of magical forces necessary
    > to cast realm spells. And I do believe the rulebook is quite clear on
    > the subject. Not that I'm a slave to the ruelbook, but I just needed
    > something to back my point :-)
    >
    Actually, the rulebook states requirements for the Magician class that are
    quite high. I forget off the top of my head, but I believe there are 3
    reasonably high stat requirements to become a Magician. This makes them at
    least as rare as Rangers or Paladins. In other words, it takes the talents of
    an unusually gifted person. They lack the natural ability to manipulate
    mebhail that blooded characters have, and therefore their path is much more
    difficult.

    This in mind, one may consider a blooded magician (with or without a kit from
    the BoM) an extremely personally talented individual that chose to specialize
    in Divination and Illusion. Logically, if a DM allows other specialist
    wizards in the campaign to cast realm spells, then so should the blooded
    magician. Personally, I would allow the specialist to do so only in their
    chosen school of specialization.

    - -DKE

  5. #5
    Pieter A de Jong
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    At 02:10 PM 6/2/98 -0400, DKE wrote:
    >In a message dated 98-06-02 12:00:30 EDT, you write:
    >
    >> I disagree. A magician has chosen an easier road to magical power than
    >> the wizard's, and does not have the command of magical forces necessary
    >> to cast realm spells. And I do believe the rulebook is quite clear on
    >> the subject. Not that I'm a slave to the ruelbook, but I just needed
    >> something to back my point :-)
    >>
    >Actually, the rulebook states requirements for the Magician class that are
    >quite high. I forget off the top of my head, but I believe there are 3
    >reasonably high stat requirements to become a Magician. This makes them at
    >least as rare as Rangers or Paladins. In other words, it takes the talents of
    >an unusually gifted person. They lack the natural ability to manipulate
    >mebhail that blooded characters have, and therefore their path is much more
    >difficult.
    >
    >This in mind, one may consider a blooded magician (with or without a kit from
    >the BoM) an extremely personally talented individual that chose to specialize
    >in Divination and Illusion. Logically, if a DM allows other specialist
    >wizards in the campaign to cast realm spells, then so should the blooded
    >magician. Personally, I would allow the specialist to do so only in their
    >chosen school of specialization.
    >
    My own take on the subject is that the way of the magician is indeed an
    easier path to magical power. Specifically, it is easier than full wizardry
    for non-blooded mortals, as full wizardry is impossible for them. Their
    bodies/minds/souls cannot handle the full power of mebhaigal neccesary for
    >2nd level non-illusion/divination spells. There is nothing saying that
    they do not understand the theory of such spells, they just can't cast them
    because they cannot handle the energies required. Were a magician suddenly
    to acquire a bloodline in my campaign, he would become a full mage. As I
    use the player's options Skills and Powers, and Spells and Magic, this would
    effectively give him a number of extra character points, which he would then
    have to pay off in terms of taking limitations (for example losing the
    ability to select rogue type weapon proficiencies as he is now focusing on
    more powerful magic) and (deficit financing alert) paying off the debt from
    future earned character points. Note, that he will know no new spells and
    will have a hard time finding any as there are very few mages who will be
    available to teach him any.

    Pieter A de Jong
    Graduate Mechanical Engineering Student
    University of Saskatchewan, Saskatoon, Canada

  6. #6
    David Sean Brown
    Guest

    SV: Magicians and sources

    > A magician who is blooded (whether he starts out as blooded or becomes
    > blooded during the campaign is in my book completely irrelevant) can collect
    > RP and can cast realm magic AS LONG as the realm spell in question is within
    > his school access. That is below level 3 for all other schools than Illusion
    > and Divination. Each realm spell has a 'level' of sorts, use it to determine
    > if the magician can cast the spell.

    Unfortunately, the nature of Realm magic is such that it requires a worker
    of true magic (ie a wizard) in order to harness it. Additionally, the
    combination of being a blooded regent and a wizard is a necessary
    combination to be able to locate sources, for only those individuals so
    attuned to the land and with the innate ability to control the magic are
    sensitive enough to feel the gental tug in their minds whch draws them to
    the various sources in Cerilia.

    At least this is my interpretation of the way things are laid out in the
    BoM and the Boxed set, as it states only wizards (those who work true
    magic) are able to use realm magic (and even then, only blooded
    wizards..pretty elitest :) )

    Sean

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