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Thread: Balance between troop unit type
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02-19-1998, 06:18 PM #31prtr02@scorpion.nspco.coGuest
Balance between troop unit type
> Are we back at discussing this again. I remember a while back when it
> was concluded that it was not 200 menn but 200 HD of troops( including horses )
> so a night unit had perhaps 60 Knights( that is 1lvl/0lvl ). If the knights are
> as high as 3lvl then there are perhaps only 40 Knights in each unit.
I was going to write a typical long-winded essay on this but, yeah; the above paragraph
pretty much says it all. It's important for some list members (myself included) to
remember that while Cerilian cultures are modeled on those of fuedal Europe, they aren't the
same. The fact that most cerilian peasents are free, let's call them yeomen, throws a wrench into the manorial system that in the RW supported the knight.
IMO, there's about 100 knights, squires and mounted sargents (about half being sargents) in
a unit of knights. In the RW during this time period (hypocritical aren't I?) many mounted
men-at-arms were no longer "knights" in the traditional, land holding sense but professional
soldiers paid for their services by the government or another lord/organization. I wouldn't
say they were mercenaries per se, but they weren't above pillaging in, say, a Latvian
"crusade" with the Tuetonic knights when things were dull in France.
The reason I went with 100 is 1) it's simple 2) HD in D&D also translates into combat power.
The knight unit (charge 6) is twice as good as INF (melee 3) so the war cards should reflect
the same order of magnitude of troops 3) I didn't think the horses HD should translate
directly, the rider is the lions share of the team's combat potential 4) people above first
level are the NCOs/officers/war band cheifs/heros scattered throughout all units to lead
them. I'd agree the number per card would be reduced if you somehow managed to collect a
bunch of 3rd level fighters into a unit. By D&D rules this would be quite a feat. For this
type of unit detail I would suggest (gasp!- another game!) C&S, which does a much better job
of representing the dynamic of medieval europe than D&D.
So much for not being long-winded. I really didn't type lots that I wanted to- really.
Randax
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02-20-1998, 02:40 AM #32c558382@showme.missouri.Guest
Balance between troop unit type
On Thu, 19 Feb 1998, Espen Andre Johnsen wrote:
> Are we back at discussing this again. I remember a while back when it
> was concluded that it was not 200 menn but 200 HD of troops( including horses )
> so a night unit had perhaps 60 Knights( that is 1lvl/0lvl ). If the knights are
> as high as 3lvl then there are perhaps only 40 Knights in each unit.
>
> Just my 4000gp.
It doesn't need to be 200 HD, it needs to be a combination of HD, THAC0,
AC, and such factors to represent a Melee 4, Defense 4, and Charge 6.
Kenneth Gauck
c558382@showme.missouri.edu
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02-21-1998, 02:59 AM #33MantaGuest
Balance between troop unit type
I think that unlike pikemen,infantary or archers who are mustered and given
basic training with their weapons, Knights are gathered from the nobles in
the province in question.Not all nobles are fighters, but those who are
tend to become knights(noble warrior kit from The comp.FTRHb.).Fighting is
their life, not their job.In times of peace the soldier from infantary
unitX or Y goes home to his faily and relaxes for a while.The noble warrior
quests,takes part in tournaments and trains for battle because battle is
glorious and glory is his goal.I´m not saying that knights progress in
levels and footsoldiers and bodyguards stay 0level for the rest of their
lives-it would make no sense!-The thing is footman veterans die more
often(they gain experience but their armor is the same!) than Knights,and
so,infantary(or archers or whatever!)units are constituted of a mix of
veterans and green members.Inmy campaign I give XP to all NPC´s ,bodyguards
included(if after 12 lucky skirmishes against huge goblins-ie bugbears- a 0
level bodyguard manages to survive why doesn´t he gain first level or pass
to second after that?He´s a person just like every PC.)
I´m sure some of you do not agree with me but this is the way I see it!
My humble 2 escudos
MANTA
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> From: Tim Nutting
> To: birthright@MPGN.COM
> Subject: Re: [BIRTHRIGHT] - Balance between troop unit types - limits
> Date: quinta-feira, 19 de fevereiro de 1998 2:41
>
> Perhaps the word "raising" was not clear. You are right, these men (and
> women - we ARE in a fantasy world here, not history) are collected from
> existing an existing stock of individuals.
>
> For Manta - What did you think I meant by "raised"?
>
> On a second issue that seems to be highly debated here. I will throw in
> that I do not believe that ANY member of the average raised fighting
force
> in question is above 1st level, or even that. Remember that 1st level is
> something special, it is something above the normal person, even the
normal
> soldier, and the normal noble. Look at the rulers of Cerilia, for the
most
> part the average is 4th level.
>
> Second:
> If the knights (even assuming a low number and not the 200 generalized
> figure) _were_ of higher level, why aren't the bodyguards. A regent's
> "elite guard" consists of a few dozen 0-level warriors. Why doesn't he
> just tell them all to go away and pay for the knights to guard him 24
hours
> a day?
>
> Third:
> We've all played 4th and 5th level characters before. How much would
> anyone here, as a your 5th level character with horse and plate armor and
> all you needs charge for your services, knowing you were in such high
> demand because your fighting skill equals that of your ruler? (Or at
least
> is pretty close)
>
> Well, my "humble" opinions (they aren't are they?)
>
> Good Gaming
> Tim Nutting
> Servant of the Gorgon :)
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