A Question

[Darkstar]

Just a quick question

What would happen if a PC commited bloodtheft on the Spider, who has
Invulnerability, and major regeneration so not easy to kill.
Would he return with his bloodline intact,
with his bloodline minus the pts stolen,
without any bloodline at all,
or would he be dead?

I am interested in everyone's thoughts on this

- --
Ian Hoskins

e-Mail: hoss@box.net.au
ICQ: 2938300
Home Page: http://www.box.net.au/~hoss/birth.html

From the Darkness we came,
and to the Darkness we will return.

[David Sean Brown]

I actually had this happen at one point in my campaign. The PCs were of
pretty high levels (7-8ish) and have been raided mercilessly by the
spiders troops for years...they finally had enough and took the majoriy of
the army, and every unit they could muster into the Spider fell..after
losing 90% of their troops and 2 PCs getting to the center, they fought
the Spider and his guard, losing most of their remainig troops and another
2 Pcs..the remaining 3 Pcs and handfull of men watched in awe as the
paladin of Haelyn pierced the Spider through his heart, stealing his
bloodline..the paladin could feel this new divine essence flow into
him...however, as they set about cleaning up the bodies of the men they
had lost (they couldn't bring them all back with them, so they were going
to try a pyre)...the paladin felt an unusual sensation..and watched as ths
Spider rose again to fight them..after defeating him again, tehy decided
to keep sticking him intermittantly (they tried decapitation and even
dismemberment to keephim from regenerating, but no go) to keep him down.
at lenth, they drew lots to see who had to stay with the men and the still
moving corpse, and who had to go and try to find out how to keep this guy
down. Finding out howto keep the Spider truly dead made for several weeks
of entertaining gaming, and was enjoyed by all...

sean

[fhilbrandt]

Invulnerability implies that there is a specific method that must be used
to kill the individual with this blood ability, and that if this method is
not used, his bloodline and regency remain intact. Therefore, it may not
be possible to commit bloodtheft if the killing stroke through the heart is
not in the Spider's method of death.

At the minimum, the PC would return with his bloodline intact, though, in
all probability, he'll probably end up dead.

Fred Hilbrandt

- ----------
> From: Darkstar
> To: birthright@MPGN.COM
> Subject: [BIRTHRIGHT] - A Question
> Date: Monday, October 27, 1997 16:32
>
> Just a quick question
>
> What would happen if a PC commited bloodtheft on the Spider, who has
> Invulnerability, and major regeneration so not easy to kill.
> Would he return with his bloodline intact,
> with his bloodline minus the pts stolen,
> without any bloodline at all,
> or would he be dead?
>
> I am interested in everyone's thoughts on this
>
> --
> Ian Hoskins
>
> e-Mail: hoss@box.net.au
> ICQ: 2938300
> Home Page: http://www.box.net.au/~hoss/birth.html
>
> From the Darkness we came,
> and to the Darkness we will return.
>> To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the
line
> 'unsubscribe birthright' as the body of the message.

[James Ruhland]

>
> What would happen if a PC commited bloodtheft on the Spider, who has
> Invulnerability, and major regeneration so not easy to kill.
> Would he return with his bloodline intact,
> with his bloodline minus the pts stolen,
> without any bloodline at all,
> or would he be dead?
>
If he isn't killed, can he really be victimized by Bloodtheft? I assume he
was brought to 0 hp, but, since he's regenerating and invulnerable, he
wasn't killed by the blows. Also, as a major Awensheg, he should be
particularly hard to victimize in this manner. But, it does bring up a q;
what happens to someone who is killed, and is a victim of bloodtheft, but
then is Raised, Ressurected, or otherwise brought back to life? My guess is
he or she would loose at least the points that were stolen, if not more. It
might be too much of a punishment to have 'em come back unblooded. I think
that this is one Ed will have to referee, ultimately...

[KAI BESTE]

> But, it does bring up a q;
> what happens to someone who is killed, and is a victim of bloodtheft, but
> then is Raised, Ressurected, or otherwise brought back to life? My guess is
> he or she would loose at least the points that were stolen, if not more. It
> might be too much of a punishment to have 'em come back unblooded. I think
> that this is one Ed will have to referee, ultimately...

I'd say they come back with their old derivation and strenght, but
only one blood point. Then they should get a chance to hunt down
their killer (in a certain amount of time) to get their bloodline
back. I didn't have the problem myself, but if the unforseen happens
I don't plan to use Raise Dead or Resurrect. Reincarnation is much
for fun...

just my 2GBs

Kai

[James Ruhland]

> Reincarnation is much
> for fun...
>
Speaking of which, has anyone developed a "BR-native" Reincarnation chart?
'Cause the ones suggested in the PH include creatures not found in Cerilia
(like comming back as an Orc...HEY! Perhaps that's how Da Ork Guard got in
here!...)

> I'd say they come back with their old derivation and strength, but only
one blood point...

That might be, IMO, to punative (comming back with only one point bloodline
strength). May as well just send 'em back unblooded, IMO (heck, they just
DIED facing the guy who stole their bloodline, probably not in better
condition now, considering that dude was either 1) killed by the rest of
the party shortly after he got you, and thus you can't get your point back
or 2) he won the battle, and stripped your body of all its magic items,
making off with them, and the other PCs recovered the body). So, come back
unblooded, and use the various ways of "persuading" some other poor blooded
sap to invest you with his bloodline...

> 2. Landed regents tend to be short on money in comparison to the
> guilds. Perhaps a little change of the taxation rules would be nice.

I second that; but change both the Trade rules and the tax rules; we don't
just want to make EVERYONE richer, we want to even it out (or do we; larger
armies, more funds? what kind of campaigns do people like? Or, just adjust
the cost of everything a bit?) One suggestion for Trade Routes could be to
divide the total by three, rather than by two, to get the income per turn.
(I.E. a TR from a Province [4] to a Province [6] would be 10/3=3 GB per
turn, instead of 5). As I said in a message I just sent, too, tax rolls can
take up TOO much time, IMO; has to be some better way to determine them.
How about this? A "Flat" tax level for all provinces (based on level and
tax rate), then a regional adjustment roll (so that you could get up to,
say, +25% to taxes in all your Provinces, or down to -25%); this, IMO,
would be a little more realistic, anyhow (when crops do well, or places are
prosperous, it tends to be over a wide area, not just localized with "boom"
in one area and "bust" the next province over), this also tends to
eliminate the smoothing out affect (trend towards the average) if you have
many provinces and holdings; the variation then doesn't affect you with the
current system, 'cause you can pretty much expect to get the average no
matter what, unless you get strange die rolls. With this system, you'd have
to plan better for poor times. Also, perhaps, some simple system to
determine the economic effect of letting raids, etc. go on in your
territories.

> 3. Mustering armies. It's unrealistic if I just snap my fingers and
> woops - there goes my elite infantry. Troups like that have to be
> trained or hired as mercenaries. Knights could be an exeption, they
> are not normal soldiers but vassals of the regent (at least in a
> feudal setting such as Anuire).

Then I'd like to see some kind of land/militia system. Bother to explain
it, but suffice to say that we* used to have a system of land grants to
soldiers, who would then be expected to maintain their equipment and
training, and muster from their THEMATA to form armies as required. The
land stayed in the trooper's family as long as they continued to provide
military service (thus, it became a self-perpetuating system, 'cause when
they got old or got killed, their son or other relative would take their
place). Thus it was an inexpensive way to keep trained troops on the muster
rolls without having to support them year round (they got paid an average
of 6 Nomismata--oh, that's GP to you blighters, per year in cash). System
worked rather well for about three centuries. In some ways this resembles
the fudal system of the west, but 1) not just "knights" (cavalry) were
supported by this system, infantry was as well and 2) Until the very end,
the central governement wasn't swiss-cheesed by landed nobles (dukes,
counts etc) who ended up with more power than they (I.E. France till about
1200 was weak as a kitten bec. of powerful, virtually independant nobles).

*We; the E. Roman Empire, aka "Byzantine" see, I told you you could pick up
ideas from history...

> 5. Rules for "conracting" Azrai's bloodline when you commit
> bloodtheft on one of his scions.

One such rule can be found in "Legends of the Hero Kings;"( P.70) if you
kill that Ogre dude, you might get it. But, it would certainly be nice to
have all the rules gathered into one sourcebook...

[Sepsis]

At 01:24 PM 10/28/97 CET, Kai Beste(BESTE@jerry.iued.uni-heidelberg.de)wrote:
>

>
>I don't plan to use Raise Dead or Resurrect. Reincarnation is much
>for fun...
>

I too only allow Reincarnation(the Priest version, not the Mage)in my BR
campaign. It fits the setting perfectly, particularly if you like the heavy
Arthurian feel. And those brought back do so minus any BL they may have
had. Although if they are the victim of Bloodtheft, I will allow them the
chance to reclaim their BL from the thief, but they have to find him/her
first. Raise Dead and Resurrection just doesn't feel right in BR, but thats
IMO. We will see the official take on this when BoP come out.


Sepsis, richt@metrolink.net (ICQ:3777956)

"War is a matter of vital importance to the State;
the province of life or death;
the road to survival or ruin.
It is mandatory that it be thoroughly studied."
-Sun Tzu,(The Art of War)-

BR Netbook: http://webpages.metrolink.net/~veleda/birth.html

[Tripp Elliott]

James Ruhland wrote:
>
> > Reincarnation is much
> > for fun...
> >
> Speaking of which, has anyone developed a "BR-native" Reincarnation chart?
> 'Cause the ones suggested in the PH include creatures not found in Cerilia
> (like comming back as an Orc...HEY! Perhaps that's how Da Ork Guard got in
> here!...)

Sure is, check on the Netbook, I recall there being one for each
religion.

Tripp

[David Sean Brown]

> > 2. Landed regents tend to be short on money in comparison to the
> > guilds. Perhaps a little change of the taxation rules would be nice.

Why is this necessary..all the landed regent has to do is create a level 0
guild and start his/her own trade route..presto..problem solved, income
gained,

Sean

[KAI BESTE]

> > > 2. Landed regents tend to be short on money in comparison to the
> > > guilds. Perhaps a little change of the taxation rules would be nice.
>
> Why is this necessary..all the landed regent has to do is create a level 0
> guild and start his/her own trade route..presto..problem solved, income
> gained,

Easier said than done. If you take a look at the Ruins of Empire
almost all guild slosts (at least in the profitable provinces) are
filled. If a regent tries to create his own guild he will be opposed
by the guilder...not that it is a problem IMC, but in the PBeM I
played in it was a major problem for the landed rulers to get their
share of the pie. A lot of guilders refused to pay taxes unless
threatenedby the ruler.
IMHO, guilders get *way* too much money compared to the rest..

just my 2GBs

Kai