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  1. #11
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    Hi,

    About what you said:

    1 - Kenneth's idea of using feats instead of prestige to represent the training of some organizations is good because of two things: first, as some of you said, it wouldn't be right to make all soldiers of an army 6th-level fighters, but a 2nd level fighter can already have four feats (if human); second, it's much easy to make a couple of feats than a full prestige class - it would be a LOT of work to make a single prestige for every group of Cerilia.

    2 - About what Raesene said, that would be nice. I remember of the prestiges submitted to the site, and they were good overall. Sure, some need a little work - a myself submitted one 10th-level prestige that could be made a 5th-level one. But when I made it I didn't even knew a prestige could have only five levels! If a remember correctly, the first prestiges with 5 levels appeared on the Forgotten Realms.
    Now, if I would redo that prestige, I would make it a 5 level one.

    3 - Finnaly, you all are talking about the "low-level" setting of Birthright. Some time ago I put a post in a topic about the NPCs for the Atlas talking about this. No one commented it, however...
    I wouldn't say it all again but, in short, what I think is that NPCs should have a higher level cap than the one that is presented on the book. If not, the DM as only one option: you don't let your players increase their character's levels. That, or very soon the PCs will be laughing at the NPCs...

  2. #12
    Senior Member teloft's Avatar
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    Originally posted by CMonkey+Nov 2 2003, 06:40 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (CMonkey @ Nov 2 2003, 06:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Ariadne@Nov 2 2003, 05:31 PM
    Most until now created prestige classes are actually 10 level based ones, some few have 5 levels...
    But there is no need, requirement or even real reason for them to be.

    I must agree with the Jew as one of the problems I&#39;ve been having with prestige classes is the low level theme of BR. For example, I wanted a prestige class for the Knights of Moonstrike Keep to give them a bit of flavour, but the entire fighting wing of the keep can&#39;t (shouldn&#39;t?) be 6th+ level, but if it&#39;s only the "command team" then much of the flavour I wanted is gone - result: a 5 level PrC with 3rd level minimum requirements.

    I just can&#39;t think of a better solution

    CM. [/b][/quote]
    I can think of it this way, thay are all training and advancing, skill vise and so one in the same direction, and thet devotion of the many will bring front the few thet acsuly master the theemd prestige class, commanders would have the class.

    now here is a thougth. you need to have commanders with sertan prestige class in order to gain acsess to sertan &#39;Unit templet&#39; or &#39;a trainer&#39; for your units. thet would be to teach the many to act in a sertan why to sertan situations, then in order to have acsess to the &#39;prestige class&#39; you acsuly have to come from such a unit.

    To master something new, never herad of before, you acsuly have to bring a prestige class to your DM and reason why in hell you have acsess to knowledge relaited to the seacrets of this class, and why in hell you can show the disiplin of training this class, and you sould also reason why in hell it fits with your history, and your culture. and to the fela of the game...

    h34r:

  3. #13
    Senior Member teloft's Avatar
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    about the low level theam.

    Yes, in older verions of DD it realy was a must.

    But what I think now, is you can acsuly have a cap on the power of the character by spiking some of the few &#39;to powerfull featurs&#39; or &#39;hig level featurs thet are not in the feel of the game&#39;

    as a variant I offer: critical table.

    a crossbow can realy kill anyone. no mater how hig level he is.

    if somone can not be killed by one good shot from a crosbow, he is out of the game. not in the feel any more..


    and btw, I like to have automatic wonding ability on a critical
    on all weapons. As in the new 3.5

    its a Con damage.

    veryfied critical, Unse a 2nd ed table DD for nice special effects.

    h34r:

  4. #14
    Administrator Green Knight's Avatar
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    I decided a long time ago to let the "low-level flavor thingie" go. It contributed nothing to my enjoyment of the game, and in 3E in particular it robbed the players of a lot of opportunity to do cool stuff.



    Most player characters are now in the 6th-10th level range.

    >

    > Fra: Kenneth Gauck <kgauck@MCHSI.COM>

    > Dato: 2003/11/02 Sun PM 08:51:56 CET

    > Til: BIRTHRIGHT-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM

    > Emne: Re: Prestige Classes [36#2057]

    >

    > The problem with PrC`s and all their cool flavor and BR`s low level setting

    > caused me to abandon the idea that nearly everyone was below 10th level.

    > I`ve bumped my ceiling up to 16th level. Too many neat feats, series of

    > feats, PrC`s, and multi-class cominations require higher level characters.

    > Much more then 2e, 3e/d20 flowers after the lower levels. So, it may be

    > prudent to re-think the low level nature of BR, without allowing the

    > pendulum to swing all the way to the other side. I used to generally cap

    > CR`s at 5, now 10 is closer to my upper limit, but I am also a bit more

    > flexible in higher level CR encounters.

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >



    Cheers

    Bjørn



    -------------------------------------------------

    WebMail fra Tele2 http://www.tele2.no

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    Cheers
    Bjørn
    DM of Ruins of Empire II PbeM

  5. #15
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    Can, open. Worms, everywhere...

    :unsure:

    CM.
    Indeed.
    Jan E. Juvstad.

  6. #16
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    Me, I like the low-level, low-magic, low-resurrection setting that is Birthright. I feel it adds a lot - a world where a +1 dagger is a priceless heirloom, rather than something to be thrown away, a world where wizards are rare and fearsome rather than for hire in every little podunk village, where a man can be ruler of one of the most powerful realms in the land without being an Epic-level character blessed by 12 gods and a master of sorcery as well.
    I could die, or the king could die, or the horse could learn to sing . . .

  7. #17
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    Me, I like the low-level, low-magic, low-resurrection setting that is Birthright. I feel it adds a lot - a world where a +1 dagger is a priceless heirloom, rather than something to be thrown away, a world where wizards are rare and fearsome rather than for hire in every little podunk village, where a man can be ruler of one of the most powerful realms in the land without being an Epic-level character blessed by 12 gods and a master of sorcery as well.
    At the most, I agree with you, but why would a +1 dagger be a "priceless heirloom"? I would always take a masterwork longsword instead of it - same bonus to attack, better damage...

    By now you shall be thinking that I&#39;m an "overpower" "munchkin" or whatever. But don&#39;t take me wrong - I&#39;m not. It&#39;s just that your campaign world must be beliavable - and for this to happen the rules must be according. If by the rules a dagger +1 is worst than a masterwork longsword (and it IS, except in some rare occasions) why would someone use the dagger instead of the sword? (ok, ok, there are some motives, like "the dagger is smaller", but I&#39;m talking about war - and even them, the difference between a +1 dagger and a masterwork dagger is very slim.)

    Actually, I&#39;m being a BETTER roleplayer by using the longsword instead of the magic dagger, because its what a real fighter would do (he would use the best weapon available, wound&#39;t him?)&#33;

    What I want to say is that sometimes people, in trying to make a "low-magic" world, like middle-earth, instead make a unreal, flawed world. In other worlds, if you want mages to be rare, it is not enough to say: "IMC, mages are rare". The rules must support this. Sure, the DM has control over the NPCs, but not over the PCs (or at least, he shoudn&#39;t have). If your NPCs don&#39;t use nor expect magic, because you say its rare in your world, and there is a PC mage, he will be unstopable...

  8. #18
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    If by the rules a dagger +1 is worst than a masterwork longsword (and it IS, except in some rare occasions) why would someone use the dagger instead of the sword?
    Such as those rare occasions when players play rogues, maybe a guild master. These characters tend to have high dexterity and likewise a tendency to have weapon finesse. Daggers are also easier to conceal and can be thrown (granted, a dangerout act with a heirloom). Overall, a longsword is a more commonly used melee weapon, but the family heirloom may have been created for the not so rare character described above.

    I do agree with your overall point about creating actual reasons why a particular world strays from the norm, rather than just using a blanket statement and assuming that will be adequate.
    Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a night. Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

  9. #19
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    Actually, I&#39;m being a BETTER roleplayer by using the longsword instead of the magic dagger, because its what a real fighter would do (he would use the best weapon available, wound&#39;t him?)&#33;
    No, you&#39;re not being a better roleplayer for that reason. If you&#39;re enjoying your game and contributing (even a little) to the enjoyment of the other players, you are a good roleplayer. If you aren&#39;t either of these, you&#39;re a bad roleplayer, for that group. Roleplaying is a big glass house dude.

    Having said / ranted that, he may not use the dagger, but he&#39;d always carry it and the day he fought a (3.0) werewolf, he&#39;d realise why it was priceless to his grandfather and he wanted his son, and his son&#39;s son to have it....

    What I want to say is that sometimes people, in trying to make a "low-magic" world, like middle-earth, instead make a unreal, flawed world. In other worlds, if you want mages to be rare, it is not enough to say: "IMC, mages are rare". The rules must support this. Sure, the DM has control over the NPCs, but not over the PCs (or at least, he shoudn&#39;t have). If your NPCs don&#39;t use nor expect magic, because you say its rare in your world, and there is a PC mage, he will be unstopable...
    I agree strongly with this, it is a major flaw in the current BRCS - it even says that regents shouldn&#39;t have default magical defences against wizards and such without making it harder to be one. One of my major house rules there - nerf the spellslingers.

    CM.

  10. #20
    Senior Member teloft's Avatar
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    I created a world back in &#39;97 when I was traveling in Finnland.

    there I had magic zones.

    // Ill try to do a little convert here.

    so each spell you know has its zone, and dosent work out side of thet zone.

    a equalient version of the spell migth be in use out site of you defolt zone, But in order to use thees codse, or logg into thows spells you have to roll.

    Even thow it isint exsisting, as you can write a e-mail and try to send it to a nonexsistant e-mail.

    You migth also like to do a little study on the zone your traveling to, in order to learn how to do the spells in thet zone.

    a mage with a sorce holding can afect what spells his domain supports. like a admin can upgrate a computer system. or Format your hard drife.

    a mage usualy has controle over whats awailable by his layline system.

    Gods have a lay-line system of there own, and thay need to do there networking for the divine spells to work


    ... I intruduces a metamagic feat thet would alow you to cast a spell instantly without any suport from a network. Witch would be the defolt.

    Sorserer have a natural talent to conect to the network, and therefore thay dont need to study as much in order for there powers to work. hench thay dont know much.

    This restricts spellcasters. and alows difrent awailability of spells by regions.


    To make a spell you know awailable by your network is a realm spell.

    Realm spells are not restricted by this.

    h34r:

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