Birthright "demihuman" Races:

[DanMcSorley]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2003, Ariadne wrote:

> Why do Half elves get a Diplomacy PENALTY??!!!



To make the whiney powergamers cry.

--

Daniel McSorley

[irdeggman]

Originally posted by Ariadne@Oct 31 2003, 06:43 AM
Why do Half-elves and Elves get a Diplomacy (and Gather information) PENALTY??!!!

Elves and Half-Elves are charismatic creatures, a bonus would make more sense...

Basically because they have been at war with almost all of the other races. The wording reflects that it doesn't always apply, only in the areas where they have an infamous reputation.

In 2nd ed it specifically talked about how humans distrusted elves and treated half-elves with great suspicion referring to them as 'changelings'.

Their natural charisma would help to offset this penalty, but not the prejudice that surrounds it.

Of all the human cultures only the Vos were specifically listed as not being on a distrust/hate status with the elves. IMO this is a whole lot better than the 3.5 bonus to half-elves for these things. Why they (the 3.5 authors) didn't give that bonus to halflings instead defies most logic, halflings are almost universally 'liked' and trusted by dem-humans and humans in all settings, except for Dark Sun that is.

In exchange where they have the infamous reputation they get a bonus to intimidation, seems to work fairly well - logically that is.

[Osprey]

Half-elves

Racial Abilities: Cerilian half-elves have the following racial traits:
• +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution.

Although it defies the 3.x standard of +2/-2 for ability modifiers, how about giving half-elves exactly half the bonuses and penalties of elves? Meaning,
+1 Dexterity, +1 Charisma, -1 Constitution, -1 Strength.

This would help explain the edge that half-elven bards and sorcerers enjoy.

Elven Blood: A half-elf can be considered an elf for many purposes, including the casting of true magic.

I would also specifically mention the half-elven access to elven racial feats like Spellsong and Elven Artisan. This is important for half-elven bards especially.

[Osprey]

I think the "outcast" effects on elves and half-elves are well-done. I would add to this a similar reaction penalty in areas where they are infamous.

I would add a +4 bonus for elves when resisting magical disease.

Aging attacks no longer exist except in homebrewed rules, is it necessary to mention it in the half-elven save bonuses?

Half-elven lifespan: Since the Sidhelien are immortal, shouldn't half-elves have longer lifespans than PHB half-elves? In my game, I gave them the PHB elven lifespans, except that they reached adulthood around 40-50 years (the 110 year old young adult elf from the PHB is idiotic - it's unchanged from the old AD&D rules when elves lived for 1000+ years). That seems reasonable for a half-immortal, yes?

I've also been playing with extended lifespans for persons with elven heritage. For instance, the child of a half-elf and human is basically 1/4 elven (genetic specifics aside) - not enough to grant the general 1/2-elven racial type, but enough elven blood to extend their lifespans beyond the human norm. This is partly inspired by Tolkien's idea of how elven blood extends the life of human lines even down through many generations (the Numenorians). Here's how I might break it down:

1/2-elven: Adult at 40 years, Max 350 + 4d100 years
1/4-elven (elven grandparent): Adult at 25 years, Max 150 + 5d20 years
1/8 elven (elven great-grandparent): Adult at 20 years, Max 125 + 3d20 years (as PHB 1/2-elf)
1/16, 1/32: As human, except +10 years to middle, old, and venerable age categories.
1/64 or less: "Elven Ancestry," +5 years to middle age+ categories

There's no major effect on the adventuring scale for PC's (hence no ECL adjustment necessary IMO), but it does add a neat flavor element, and allows for half-elves like the High Mage Aelies to live for centuries without the Long Life blood ability. What do you think?

[teloft]

i View the elves to be tha natzy of the world.

Natcy: We are all equal, by you people are not part of us (comunistic among them slefe, but fasistic toward others)

Anarcy: like comunists without a central goverment or anyone thinking whats best for you.

___

Imortality.

in Tolkien there was a elf thet loved a human, and gave herself to him. and by thet act she lost her imortality, and finaly left this world to follow her love to the afterlife.

Would this be possible here?

h34r:

[The Jew]

I like the modifiers to diplomacy, gather information and intimidate. One minor mechanics point, the modifiers should be circumstance, not racial. They are not innate to the elves, but apply when the elves are in the right (or wrong) geographic area due to historical circumstances.

[The Jew]

Osprey wrote:
>I would also specifically mention the half-elven access to elven racial feats >like Spellsong and Elven Artisan. This is important for half-elven bards >especially.


This should be based upon the individual half-elfs life and so left up to the DM. If a half-elf grew up in elven lands, they probably should have access, but if they grew up in human lands and have human cultural attitudes and traits, then maybe the elves would not be willing to share these feats with the half-human.

[the Falcon]

Reasene Andu wrote:

"Halflings [...]
• +2 Dexterity, -2 Strength. [...]
Elves [...]
• +2 Dexterity, +2 Charisma, -2 Strength, -2 Constitution."

I would like to see halflings have lower Strength score than sidhelien. After all, they are smaller, have lower Str in 2e Br too, and are considered elf-like by many to boot. So I propose +4 Dex, -4 Str for halflings.

--the Falcon

[the Falcon]

Raesene Andu wrote:

"• Shadow Sense: Halflings possess the ability to attune their vision to the shadow world. This provides them with a limited ability to sense undead, necromantic magic, powerful evil, and areas where the veil between Aebrynis and the Shadow World is thin. [...]"

So how does it work exactly?

[the Falcon]

Raesene Andu wrote:

"• Increased Density: A dwarf's dense body provides DR 1/slashing. Dwaves suffer a -4 penalty to swim and tumble checks.
Now changed to DR 1+Con modifier/slashing."

I don't know, this could go either way. On the one hand, having DR seems to warrent a Level Adjustment to me. On the other hand, if you're a dwarf and fighting against anyone who knows anything about dwarves, you'll just be set upon with piercing and bludgeoning attacks, totally negating your DR. It just seems to conditional to be a feature for a player character race. If and when this ability is useful kind of totally depends on the whim of the DM, rather than the wishes of the player. Also, mind you, bite attacks are piercing, slashing and bludgeoning, so against a lot of creatures who do not have the option of switching weapons it's pretty useless, too.

In short, it just doesn't seem to be worth the while. I would just leave it out and maybe change the ability adjustments to something like +2 Strength, +2 Constitution, –2 Dexterity, –2 Charisma for that extra kick.

--the Falcon