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  1. #11
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    Yes "blooded" sounds werid for undead. But Usurpation allows the divine energy to enter animals and sometimes inanimate objects, so it is just a term for me.

    I assume that the blast at Desimaar flooded the area with the divine energy.

    Perhaps there is only archtype of the intelligent undead, or a very small number.

    As the Hydra gave birth to the hydras in the swamps, perhaps these few"blooded" undead are the creators (or at least controllers) of the lesser intelligent undead.

  2. #12
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Osprey@Sep 20 2003, 12:44 AM
    How the heck could undead have a Blooded descriptor? Divine power, sure, but in the form of a bloodline? :blink:
    IN 2nd ed, just because a scion died didn't mean he was no longer blooded. He no longer had any regency and his tie to the land but there was nothing that really stated he lost his bloodline unless he was slain through the heart.
    Duane Eggert

  3. #13
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Not all enemies need to be evil. In Birthright alignments are more greyed than in say the Realms. Motivations determine whether or not someone is an enemy. Avan and Boeroine are most definitely enemies but neither is "evil".
    Duane Eggert

  4. #14
    Site Moderator geeman's Avatar
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    At 05:18 PM 9/20/2003 +0200, destowe wrote:



    > Yes "blooded" sounds werid for undead. But Usurpation allows

    > the divine energy to enter animals and sometimes inanimate objects, so it

    > is just a term for me.

    >

    > I assume that the blast at Desimaar flooded the area with the divine energy.

    >

    > Perhaps there is only archtype of the intelligent undead, or a very

    > small number.



    A bloodline for a vampire sounds doable... especially with the whole stab

    through the heart similarity.



    Other undead, however, being less fleshy or tied to things of the flesh

    (and blood) are less vulnerable to chest wounds and might, therefore, not

    necessarily be apt for bloodlines. Those who are shifted into another

    plane might be similarly inappropriate, since it`s debatable what happens

    to a bloodline when it is away from Aebrynis.



    Gary

  5. #15
    Senior Member Doyle's Avatar
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    IMC, Mount Desimaar still exists on the SW, and holds the SW`s only

    level 10 source point. All that negative energy from the deaths of so

    many has got to spill out in a number of ways.

    If the Cold Rider does hold a large proportion of Azrai`s essence

    (accounts for the missing essence), couldn`t he / she imbue some of the

    more powerful undead with some bloodline to better guard his / her

    lands?



    Doyle



    -----Original Message-----

    From: Destowe

    <snip>



    Would that make undead template a type of blooded scion? It could

    easily account for much of Azrai`s missing presence.



    A second point. I am not real familar with the SW. But it sounds like

    the blast at Desimaar would have only destroyed the mountain on the

    Anuirean side. Would the mountain still exist on the SW. Perhaps by

    now it is the resting place of the Cold Rider and his armies.
    Doyle

  6. #16
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Doyle@Sep 20 2003, 06:04 PM
    IMC, Mount Desimaar still exists on the SW, and holds the SW`s only

    level 10 source point. All that negative energy from the deaths of so

    many has got to spill out in a number of ways.

    If the Cold Rider does hold a large proportion of Azrai`s essence

    (accounts for the missing essence), couldn`t he / she imbue some of the

    more powerful undead with some bloodline to better guard his / her

    lands?



    Doyle

    Except for the fact that a bloodline is not a granted thing. They only came about because of the "death" and the spilt blood of the former gods. IMO is a dangerous thing to try to create a method for creating new ways to create bloodlines other than the death of a god.

    In 2nd ed it wasn&#39;t possible to pass a portion of one&#39;s bloodline it was either the entire thing or none at all. So the mechanic of imbuing a creature with a portion of one&#39;s bloodline is shaky at best.

    Also what bloodline would the CR pass? It shouldn&#39;t be Azrai, since even if it holds a large portion of Azrai&#39;s blood it is different enough to be a unique creature of its own. Would Haelyn pass on Andurias bloodline or his own if he died so violently? IMO it would be his own which would have different aspects than does Anduirias&#39;.
    Duane Eggert

  7. #17
    Senior Member Doyle's Avatar
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    I was going on the `the CR is what was remaining of Azrai after the

    battle` theory. Also, isn`t there some spell `imbue bloodline` or

    something like that? It may have been something I got from a post long

    ago that was never formally integrated in.

    Doyle.



    -----Original Message-----

    From: irdeggman

    <snip>

    Also what bloodline would the CR pass? It shouldn`t be Azrai, since

    even if it holds a large portion of Azrai`s blood it is different enough

    to be a unique creature of its own. Would Haelyn pass on Andurias

    bloodline or his own if he died so violently? IMO it would be his own

    which would have different aspects than does Anduirias`.
    Doyle

  8. #18
    Site Moderator kgauck's Avatar
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    ----- Original Message -----

    From: "irdeggman" <brnetboard@BIRTHRIGHT.NET>

    Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 6:11 PM



    > Except for the fact that a bloodline is not a granted thing.



    I believe we are talking about bloodline investiture (p81 BoP) with the

    alteration that one can invest a part of one`s bloodline. Alternatly, the

    bloodline is taken by force from captives and bloodline investiture is used

    to "imbue some of the

    more powerful undead with some bloodline". Whether the source of this

    bloodline is captives, defeated enemies, the Cold Rider, or some other

    source, its transmitted by bloodline investiture.



    Kenneth Gauck

    kgauck@mchsi.com

  9. #19
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    On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, irdeggman wrote:

    > Except for the fact that a bloodline is not a granted thing. They only

    > came about because of the "death" and the spilt blood of the

    > former gods. IMO is a dangerous thing to try to create a method for

    > creating new ways to create bloodlines other than the death of a god.



    Well, canonically, Azrai was doing /something/ to create the Lost prior to

    Deismaar. They were the moral equivalent of blooded, since they were

    humans who could cast true magic. It`s not too far fetched for the Cold

    Rider to be able to pull off something similar, if he`s the remnant of

    Azrai in your game.



    Mechanically, there are other precedents, for instance, a deity granting

    proxyhoood (to use Planescape/3rd edition D&Dg terms) looks remarkably

    like granting part of its divine bloodline to a servant. The deity`s

    divine rank goes down, the proxy gains those ranks for itself. It gets

    salient blood abilities, too, which is the D&Dg version of blood abilities

    for someone with a one-step-beyond True bloodline status. From a certain

    point of view :)



    --

    Daniel McSorley

  10. #20
    Senior Member Osprey's Avatar
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    Personally, I&#39;m not much of a fan of undead with bloodlines. Blood is the source of life, just as the heart is the source of the blood. This is very central to BR&#39;s themes, as I see it, and shoyuldn&#39;t be meddled with too much.

    IMO, gods don&#39;t have bloodlines because they aren&#39;t flesh and blood. They&#39;re spirits, Outsiders, deities, call them what you will, but certainly not mortals anymore. Bloodlines were the distinct result of deific energies interacting with mortals, and that energy found a way to merge with two things: life (the blood), and the land. And what is mebhaighal but the spiritual lifesblood of the land, a source like the heart of a province?

    However, blooded scions as a source for greater undead is VERY appealing. But I see that blooded template as a source of transformative (necromantic) magic, allowing for powerful undead with special powers and abilities. They trade off (not necessarilly voluntarily) blood abilities and connections with the land for their connection to the Shadow World and the powers granted by that.

    Now a "Shadow Bloodline" based on negative energy, tying into the power of the Shadow World, might be very cool, and appropriate. Heh, heh... h34r:

    -Osprey

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