Facing the Manslayer...and playtest comments

[Alhazen]

Yes thats right.. this is my first post in the forums.. my friends and I recently started a 3rd edition BIRTHRIGHT campaign after everyone downladed all the new rules.. we're very happy with the conversion except for a few minor typos and an odd reference to "elite" units even though apparently they do not exist. Also, why can archer units only fire at a unit directly beside them? whats the good of having longrange? is there no such thing as an anuirean longbowman? there should be a special training for "range increase". Its silly that you cant place a rank of your infantry in front of your archers for shielding to allow the archers to fire over the foot's heads.

Anyways, in this new campaign, my regent character **anuirean** has a somewhat tricky situation to deal with. One of his lieutenants sent a missive to Rhoubhe Manslayer, sending greetings and asking to open contact between our two realms. Rhoubhe replied, saying he was pleased and that I should come visit him. I was like--no way, but was courteous and invited him to my own court.

well--he came. everyone was scared silly, so i spent about 5 GB on a lavish dinner/feast to welcome him, and tried to diplomacy with him. Luckly i rolled a 20, and ended up with a check of 74 or some such. so he didnt kill me right there.

However, he did give me an ultimatum. after discussing current events in my realm--which includes a tricky situation with a neighbor..some of my men were establishing a Law 0 holding in a neighboring realm, well, the mercanaries employed by that realm's ruler killed some of my men, destroying the holding. I demaded justice, but the ruler was powerless to stop them without causing civil war. Rhoubhe demanded I either bring him the head of the mercenary who killed my men--tricky--, or i invade Ghoere, or i defy him. And there is only one right choice, he was sure to let me know..if i chose wrong, he would take my head.

Well, this news spread like fire throughout the land, that the Manslayer was active after several years.. i do not want war..but i can afford a large and capable army..my plans as the moment are, to diplomacy with my neighboring regents, secretly assemble forces, and then when the time comes, to invade Rhoubhe himself..in other words, to choose Defiance. It will be a "no elf can command the Duke" thing, an insult to my king, and my people..hopefully this will foster a great Crusade against the manslayer..ive already gotten 4 PC realms to sign on for this crusade, and im certain 3 other NPC realms will send troops as well.

I can aford to maintain a 20-30 unit army when at war, and my archpriest PC friend plans to raise a horde of undead (10-12 units) ("even our ancestors rise to defend our land") thing.. with around 15-20 units coming in from allies, this is quite a large force ,to be certain..

All of the PCs are 15-18th level..not enough to take on the manslayer seriously..but, if i take his province, do you think he would negotiate?

[DanMcSorley]

On Wed, 11 Jun 2003, Alhazen wrote:
> Also, why can archer units only fire at a unit directly beside them?
> whats the good of having longrange? is there no such thing as an
> anuirean longbowman? there should be a special training for "range
> increase". Its silly that you cant place a rank of your infantry in
> front of your archers for shielding to allow the archers to fire over
> the foot`s heads.

You misunderstand the war card system. The squares are not like a square
on a tactical map that is 5x5 and one person stands in it, threatening the
area around him. They represent a strategic area of the battlefield.
Several units, both friendly and enemy, can be in the square at a time.
And no non-missile units can attack outside their own square at all, so
for archers to be able to do it is a good approximation of long range. To
have a unit of infantry and a unit of archers defended by them, place them
in the same square.

> I can aford to maintain a 20-30 unit army when at war, and my archpriest
> PC friend plans to raise a horde of undead (10-12 units) ("even our
> ancestors rise to defend our land") thing.. with around 15-20 units
> coming in from allies, this is quite a large force ,to be certain..
>
> All of the PCs are 15-18th level..not enough to take on the manslayer
> seriously..but, if i take his province, do you think he would negotiate?

No. First, you won`t take his province, probably, he`ll guerilla you to
pieces and hit with magic when your men are encamped. Even if you occupy
the province, you won`t be able to bring his men to battle, the sneaky
snivelling elvses :) He wouldn`t negotiate with a human he didn`t
consider his equal, I`d say.
--
Daniel McSorley

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[Alhazen]

thanks for the explanation of the system.. i can see what youre saying, but it still seems a little off to only get one phase of attack before they are upon you..

ANd about the Elf, it seems I have little choice.. its either attack him, or allow him to just waltz into my castle and take my bloodline.

[Green Knight]

Indeed, as a system for tactical combat, the war cards system has always sucked BIG TIME.

It is more of a Quick Battle Resolution System in my opinion. If you keep that in mind the system is platable, more so than any other Quick system I have seen so far.

[Karl Shenk graf von Stauf]

dealing with the Manslayer is tricky, dont forget who this elf is. Rhoubhe styles himself the defender of all things elven, and if he comes to diplomacy with a non elven realm, it is surely for the worst. after all he is called the manslayer:)
on the strategic situation, war with elves espesially brought to their homeland could be tricky. one can avoid the ills of elven incursion by attacking their only province, but that is on their advantage. Elven warfare is largely based on hit and run tactics and clever manouevers - they can do that on their grounds better than on anywhere else. Ambushes and flanking will be used extensivelly. they will do that for one additional reason- they have small numbers. Rhoubhe is an acomplished wizard of course and he will propably have summoned numerous humanoid units plus undead,but only a small number of his followers are of elven blood, mayhaps less than a thousand. the quality of elven archers is scarry, that is with some distance between them and ones units.
one thing encouraging is that u have many pc regents dedicated to your cause, and that pc lieutenant ( archpriest) could be of great value.
Maybe u could consider facing the manslayer legions on friendly or neutral lands?
the elf is propably trying to trick you into something, that anyone can tell, but that is not necessarily war. maybe you can trick him into something instead but in the strategic, not the tactical field?
Karl Shenk graf von Staufenberg

[Barliman]

Originally posted by Alhazen
I can aford to maintain a 20-30 unit army when at war, and my archpriest PC friend plans to raise a horde of undead (10-12 units) ("even our ancestors rise to defend our land") thing.. with around 15-20 units coming in from allies, this is quite a large force ,to be certain..

All of the PCs are 15-18th level..not enough to take on the manslayer seriously..but, if i take his province, do you think he would negotiate?

The duke consults with the dead? Surely he must have been poisoned and is under the control of an evil sorcerer. Perhaps the Archpriest is no preist at all...

I would expect the Manslayer to do a couple few things:
-bring in troops from Taurheivel and the Seilwode to aid in his own defense.
-Cast Warding to keep you out of his province. He's high enough level to block most attempts at dispelling his magic
-Cast Transport on some of your invading troops shipping them to who knows where (some recently developed/hidden source)