Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    32
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Are these still free??

    Where is it discussed??

  2. #2
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Virginia Beach, Virginia
    Posts
    3,946
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    They are not mentioned because they are no longer "free" actions. I always preferred the description of "bonus" action to avoid confusing it with the cost of the action. The decision to not give free actions came about mostly becasue of the relative ease that a character could multi-class in 3rd edition. So if a character picked up a level of rogue (formerly thief) and cleric would he be eligible for 2 free actions, an espionage and an agitate? It was these kind of game balance issues that caused this decision in the development phase.

    There is a whole description on what a free action is and what a standard action is that should help explain what can and cannot be done.:)
    Duane Eggert

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    32
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Couldn't you have just ruled that a character must have OVER 1/2 of their levels as Cleric or as Rogue to get the bonus action.

    And, to even the field ever further, instead of a Bonus action, it could be a regular action taken as a court action.

    Or at least give them a bonus to these actions.

  4. #4
    Birthright Developer
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Gothenburg, Sweden
    Posts
    949
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Under the current rules, anyone can get espionage as a court action - you need to create a spy network in a province first, however, as per the rules on page 109.
    Jan E. Juvstad.

  5. #5
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Virginia Beach, Virginia
    Posts
    3,946
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Originally posted by Rhobher Nichaleir


    Couldn't you have just ruled that a character must have OVER 1/2 of their levels as Cleric or as Rogue to get the bonus action.

    And, to even the field ever further, instead of a Bonus action, it could be a regular action taken as a court action.

    Or at least give them a bonus to these actions.
    The real question is the "bonus" action or the "bonus to the action" as you request based on class or should it be based on holdings? Having a level in a class shouldn't qualify someone to be any better at management or piety (as far as the masses go) it would depend on what you did with that "level". Did you learn better skills? Did you acquire/invest inmore "contacts" and "informants", etc?

    Simply basing a free action or even a bonus to an action soley on having levels in a certain class just doesn't pass the "logic" test. :)
    Duane Eggert

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    883
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    irdeggman wrote:

    >This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
    > You can view the entire thread at: http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1499
    >irdeggman wrote:
    > They are not mentioned because they are no longer "free" actions. I always preferred the description of "bonus" action to avoid confusing it with the cost of the action. The decision to not give free actions came about mostly becasue of the relative ease that a character could multi-class in 3rd edition. So if a character picked up a level of rogue (formerly thief) and cleric would he be eligible for 2 free actions, an espionage and an agitate? It was these kind of game balance issues that caused this decision in the development phase.
    >
    This question had already be answered by the 2E Book of Priestcraft:
    Class is not the only thing that matters. A fighter for example who
    multiclasses to priest to get a "free Agitate" would get none - the Book
    of Priestcraft explicitely stated that a priest needs to rule temples to
    get it (p. 64 BoP).

    It would be similar with Thiefs/Rogues and guild if a Book of Guildcraft
    would have been published I assume.

    >There is a whole description on what a free action is and what a standard action is that should help explain what can and cannot be done.:)
    >
    But the whole draft 0.0 system is only beneficial to people with large
    courts where more GB spent mean more actions.
    It does lack the mechanic to let very skilled characters do an extra
    action while not being able or willing to spend GB on court.

    In 2E we had Thief/Espionage and Cleric/Agitate extra action by class in
    addition to the normal 3 actions of a realm. In Travis Dooms conversion
    we had this and an extra Agitate action when succeeding a Leadership
    skill, however with a DC I find personally set too low as an extra
    action is valuable.

    I would like to see implemented that money=courtlevel=up to 5 actions
    would not be the only thing that matters, but that very skilled
    individuals (e.g. Highmage Aelies makes a Scry check at DC XX and gets
    an extra SCRY action, Fhilereane makes a Gather Information check at
    DCXX and gets an extra ESPIONAGE action). The DC´s should be high to
    avoid an inflation of actions. And they should not be inaddition to the
    maximum of 5 buyable actions to prevent the rich AND skilled to have
    even more actions. Rather within the limit of 5 actions, people who do
    not field a enourmous court but are very skilled should be able to get
    an extra action.
    bye
    Michael Romes

    ************************************************** **************************
    The Birthright Homepage: http://www.birthright.net
    Birthright-l Archives: http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/birthright-l.html
    To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM
    with UNSUB BIRTHRIGHT-L in the body of the message.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    32
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Originally posted by irdeggman


    Originally posted by Rhobher Nichaleir


    Couldn't you have just ruled that a character must have OVER 1/2 of their levels as Cleric or as Rogue to get the bonus action.

    And, to even the field ever further, instead of a Bonus action, it could be a regular action taken as a court action.

    Or at least give them a bonus to these actions.
    The real question is the "bonus" action or the "bonus to the action" as you request based on class or should it be based on holdings? Having a level in a class shouldn't qualify someone to be any better at management or piety (as far as the masses go) it would depend on what you did with that "level". Did you learn better skills? Did you acquire/invest inmore "contacts" and "informants", etc?


    'Over Half'

    Simply basing a free action or even a bonus to an action soley on having levels in a certain class just doesn't pass the "logic" test. :)

  8. #8
    Site Moderator Ariadne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    near Frankfurt/ Germany
    Posts
    801
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Originally posted by irdeggman

    They are not mentioned because they are no longer "free" actions.
    Really? That's sad, but I see the problem. Maybe a character with rogue and cleric levels gets only the bonus of his higher class...
    Just an idea...
    May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    32
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    Originally posted by ConjurerDragon
    I would like to see implemented that money=courtlevel=up to 5 actions
    would not be the only thing that matters, but that very skilled
    individuals (e.g. Highmage Aelies makes a Scry check at DC XX and gets
    an extra SCRY action, Fhilereane makes a Gather Information check at
    DCXX and gets an extra ESPIONAGE action). The DC´s should be high to
    avoid an inflation of actions. And they should not be inaddition to the
    maximum of 5 buyable actions to prevent the rich AND skilled to have
    even more actions. Rather within the limit of 5 actions, people who do
    not field a enourmous court but are very skilled should be able to get
    an extra action.
    bye
    Michael Romes
    This I like, a maximum of 5 actions, and a possibility of earning more actions than court spending by 'skill' vs DC 20+(2*action wanted). So if your court allows three actions you'd roll vs DC 28 for action 4 and DC30 for action 5.

    DC too high, too low?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
BIRTHRIGHT, DUNGEONS & DRAGONS, D&D, the BIRTHRIGHT logo, and the D&D logo are trademarks owned by Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and are used by permission. ©2002-2010 Wizards of the Coast, Inc.