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  1. #1
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    Use Charisma instead. :)

    Sometimes thing simply need to be made simpler, for the benefit of the entire game.

  2. #2
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    Originally posted by ecliptic
    Use Charisma instead. :)

    Sometimes thing simply need to be made simpler, for the benefit of the entire game.
    You do have a point, there.

    Charisma reflects force of personality, which most scions have in spades (though not necessarily in the same way). Tie the actually bloodline system to the templates or whatever system gets chosen, but have the ability score used along with it be Charisma.

    I never though of that before, and I think I'll test it out.
    I walk this fine thread...

    Mourn

  3. #3
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    So scions would most likely be bards and sorcerers since Charisma is their prime ability? I would not favor something that has certain class types being more powerful scions. It should not favor any one class in its application.
    Duane Eggert

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    Use prime ability, then no class will be favored ;)

  5. #5
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Nikolai II


    Use prime ability, then no class will be favored ;)
    What about multi-calss characters? Since the 3rd edition rules have allowed (and basically encouraged) more multiclassing this doesn't quite hold sway either.

    Now I do understand why charisma is a good ability to score to use for scion seeing how they are very leadership based, but it would cause many problems to choose an ability score that is so tied to certain classes. Using a varying ability score, for each character is also quite cumbersome and logic-losing. I mean every player would choose his character's highest ability to use as the base one for his blood.
    Duane Eggert

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    At 05:53 PM 3/16/2003 +0100, you wrote:
    >This post was generated by the Birthright.net message forum.
    > You can view the entire thread at:
    http://www.birthright.net/read.php?TID=1437
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    > irdeggman wrote:
    > So scions would most likely be bards and sorcerers since Charisma is
    their prime ability? I would not favor something that has certain class
    types being more powerful scions. It should not favor any one class in its
    application.

    Agreed. IMO Charisma is already an overpowered stat - you can use it to add
    to AC (arcane duelist, mystic wanderer, shaman), damage (iaijutsu master,
    divine might), initiative (iaijutsu master), saving throws (many classes),
    and spellcasting (again many classes).

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  7. #7
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Actually Shade I think that 3rd ed finally found a reason to watch your character's charisma score instead of minimizing it, as was the norm in 2nd edition.
    Duane Eggert

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by irdeggman
    So scions would most likely be bards and sorcerers since Charisma is their prime ability? I would not favor something that has certain class types being more powerful scions. It should not favor any one class in its application.
    Well.. let's see... the sorcerer's power stems from his blood, which sounds similar to a scion to me.

    And how does it make them more powerful? How is a scion sorcerer who relies solely on Charisma more powerful than a scion wizard that relies on Intelligence and Charisma?

    If Charisma was the ability score related to Bloodline, then it would give a scion fighter a good reason to have a high Charisma (which he lacks now, because he has only one Charisma-based skill).

    Originally posted by Shade
    Agreed. IMO Charisma is already an overpowered stat - you can use it to add
    to AC (arcane duelist, mystic wanderer, shaman), damage (iaijutsu master,
    divine might), initiative (iaijutsu master), saving throws (many classes),
    and spellcasting (again many classes).
    Overpowered?! HOW?!

    Arcane duelist, mystic wanderer, and shaman add it to their AC. Big deal. So, if one of these fellows with a 12 Charisma (+1 to AC), he's overpowered? And this benefit only comes IF YOU TAKE THIS CLASS, which you gain as a benefit for a level.

    And as for iaijitsu master... why even bring it up when monk, a core class, is such an issue for people? Plus, that also requires you to purchase ranks in a skill, and it can only be used at certain times.

    Divine might is a feat... and clerics and paladins, the primary characters who would take such a feat, do not have any bonus feats, so they have to spend one of their six level-based feats on it. Then, they have to use up a limited daily-use ability to activate the power.

    As for the saving throw bonus... a few classes gain it, and again... it's a class feature. There are other levels in most of those classes where they gain no additional benefit. Also, a good deal of those classes heavily rely on a different ability score (like Paladins, who rely on Wisdom for spellcasting and Strength for their combat ability).

    And spellcasting... how is making the primary ability Charisma making it overpowered? Yeah, sorcerers use Charisma for spells, but have no Charisma-based skills. Why isn't Intelligence as a spellcasting ability score overpowered... after all, a high Intelligence also gives wizards more skill points.
    I walk this fine thread...

    Mourn

  9. #9
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    > irdeggman wrote:
    > So scions would most likely be bards and sorcerers since Charisma is
    their prime ability? I would not favor something that has certain class
    types being more powerful scions. It should not favor any one class in its
    application.


    Some of us do play characters with high charisma`s that are not Bard`s or
    Sorcery`s.

    I`m currently playing a Fighter whose lowest score is strength and highest
    score is charisma.

    Its all about Character Concepts, not Min-Maxing fun.

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  10. #10
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    From: "Shade" <lordshade@SOFTHOME.NET>

    > IMO Charisma is already an overpowered stat - you can use it to add
    > to AC (arcane duelist, mystic wanderer, shaman), damage (iaijutsu master,
    > divine might), initiative (iaijutsu master), saving throws (many classes),
    > and spellcasting (again many classes).
    >


    The operative word here is CAN. Most characters don`t get to apply their
    Charisma to any of these values - but with certain enablers,you CAN. It
    would be the same with bloodlines - certain characters CAN add their
    Charisma mod to certain things - but far from all WILL. In toto, Charisma is
    still a weak attribute.

    And if there is a single standard attribute that should unite all scions,
    nothing can beat Charisma!

    /Carl


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