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Thread: Additional races?
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03-02-2003, 09:20 PM #41
At 07:39 PM 3/2/2003 +0100, irdeggman wrote:
>I would think that at least goblins and orogs would have some sort of regency.
Are there any other races (or species of intelligent creatures) that might
have been at Deismaar? We know about a dragon or two, but what other
monsters might have been present? There could have been a few giants, for
example, present at the battle as might ogres, treants, centaurs, ettins,
lycanthropes and trolls.
Though there are blooded creatures of animal intelligence, having gained a
bloodline at Deismaar would seem to be limited to intelligent creatures for
the most part. IIRC, at least one person has premised bloodlines existing
in a "race" of horses present at Deismaar amongst the cavalry, but if that
were anything other than an exception there would be hundreds of such
animals, in addition to probably thousands of the crows and ravens who
flock to a battlefield for the tasty . The list of AD&D Monsters in
Cerilia on p89 of the RB lists several types of monsters that could take
place in war handled in a similar manner.
Gary
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03-02-2003, 10:34 PM #42
----- Original Message -----
From: "Azrai" <brnetboard@TUARHIEVEL.ORG>
Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2003 11:17 AM
>
> That is a very conservative view of the game. I should be clear that all
> these races exist in Cerilia (Orog, Sahuagin etc.). So I see absolutely
> not reason why not to allow to play them. A good DM should be able
> to point out that these races are not common and can have some
> problems in civilized areas.
They should also be having problems with each other. I can see a one-time
congregation for a specific purpose (the heroes of the Great Bay join forces
to combat something that threatens all), but holding a party together over
many adventures requires that the party not be the only members of their
species who don`t have cultural and religious reasons for prefering the
members of the party humbled. Any one of these characters could exist (even
the elf cleric), but by themselves is an extreamly exceptional charcater.
Combining character concepts that turn the setting on its head, and jumbling
them together, the keeping them together for a campaign thumbs its nose at
the rivalries and assumptions the setting creates. With some changes that
will preserve the essentials of character concepts, a much happy
combinations of characters can be assembled.
Kenneth Gauck
kgauck@mchsi.com
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03-02-2003, 11:54 PM #43Originally posted by Shade
Another thing - if a player REALLY wants to play a bizarre race like half-dragon or genasi, bloodform and bloodtrait could be used to account for the physical changes. The genasi logically correspond to the four elemental bloodlines - Anduiras, Reynir, Masela and Basaia. A weak bloodtrait power in one of those lines could effectively make you a genasi. Bloodform could easily turn someone into a draconic creature.May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!
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03-03-2003, 06:17 AM #44
Shade wrote:
> If a player REALLY wants to play a bizarre race [...] bloodform and
> bloodtrait could be used to account for the physical changes.
Ariadne wrote:
> Why? If someone REALLY wants to play an exotic race then let him...
Because the setting limits what is possible. At some point, you either have
to make so many comprimises that you feel you`ve sold out your vision of
Cerilia or you have to say no. I haven`t spent years (very literally)
building this world to throw all that away because someone wants to play a
multi-planar, psionic drow cleric of Lolth. Sometimes its better to decide
that BR is not the best world for every player. BR is a distinctive setting
because some things are possible and other things are not. If every setting
allows everything, then all settings are the same, only the names have been
changed to confuse the innocent.
Kenneth Gauck
kgauck@mchsi.com
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03-03-2003, 09:06 AM #45
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From: "Kenneth Gauck" <kgauck@MCHSI.COM>
> Because the setting limits what is possible. At some point, you either
have
> to make so many comprimises that you feel you`ve sold out your vision of
> Cerilia or you have to say no.
>
I very much agree. Additionally, a conversion manual should focus on what is
unique for this setting. There are rules for Half-Dragons in other settings,
so there is no need to detail them here. There are currently no half-dragons
in Cerilia, so there is no need to explain how they fit into society. A DM
who wants half-dragons in his game is of course free to introduce them, but
why should they be in the conversion? What would be so unique about Carilian
half-dragons (if they existed) that it needs to be mentioned?
I think the problem with the current document is that it is too large and
complex rather than that it is too small. Including things "because they
could exist" isn`t a good enough reason.
This said, I can certainly see how a bloodform character could start to
mutate into a reptilian, dragon-like creature. That would be a unique
creature, at least until he started to spawn. Perhaps he will become known
as The Kobold? ; )
/Carl
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03-03-2003, 02:04 PM #46Originally posted by Birthright-L (Carl Kramer)
There are rules for Half-Dragons in other settings, so there is no need to detail them here. There are currently no half-dragons in Cerilia, so there is no need to explain how they fit into society.May Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!
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03-03-2003, 04:50 PM #47
At 03:04 PM 3/3/2003 +0100, Ariadne wrote:
>How do you want to define an ECL in BR, if using Bloodform or Bloodtrait?
I wrote up an Awnsheghlien/Ersheghlien prestige class a while back. There
are several benefits for interpreting bloodform and bloodtrait into that
mechanic, not the least of which is that it figures right into the ECL system.
Gary
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03-04-2003, 09:22 AM #48
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No need races should be included in the Book. If you want Genasi character feel free to have them in your campaign, but don't make them canon material. I personally feel that there is no need to add any other race. Not even the gnomes. I agree with whomever said that the mentioning of the gnome in the monster list is a TSR mistake.
I could understand a gnoll or goblin or orog race listing, but those races are not meant for the PCs as a canon. In my campaign I would allow all of my PCs to be gnolls (but I would not combine gnolls with humans as I don't combine even elves with humans) but even if I allowed for this, I would not request it to be part of a book with the rules.
If new races such as Genasi or Half dragons are added, then the Birthright feel is SEVERELY compromised..... we would get a Forgotten Realms setting with different maps....
As a final note, I do not feel that the absence of the Half-Ogre is bad either. I would understand it being there, but I don't care if it is not either.
I think I pretty much agree with mark Aurel.... I usually agree with him :P
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03-04-2003, 03:12 PM #49
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I'm very new, 3rd edition new, to Birthright and I'm here because it different enough - I quite like monks (ooo - off topic!) and dont mind gnomes, but I've voted no.
Firmly in the "not canon" camp I'm afraid.
CM.
[edit]
Actually, I think d20 BR it doesn't go far enough with the "core stripping". For example, I'd like to see the Paladin made into a prestige class , but, like someone else said, thats for the authors, not us, to decide one way or the other.
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03-05-2003, 01:05 AM #50
I think I pretty much agree with mark Aurel.... I usually agree with him :PMay Khirdai always bless your sword and his lightning struck your enemies!
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