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  1. #1
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    This is a question for the design team...

    Under Cultural Traits for some Humans it says:

    "<Skill name(s)> is (are) considered class skill(s) for you at first level."

    Now does this mean:

    1) That the aforementioned skill is only a class skill at first level and thereafter reverts to the way it would normally be for your chosen class?

    or

    2) That the aforementioned skill is a class skill from 1st level forward?

    If it is meant to be the later it might be better just saying:

    "<Skill name(s)> is (are) considered class skill(s) for you."

    Thanks,
    Joseph Miller

  2. #2
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    At first level and only first level you are granted the ability of certain racial skills. From second level onward you must choose your skills as you would as if race was not considered. I believe this is the second time it's been addressed so there seems to be some confusion and the definate need for more clarity.

    Mike Spehar

  3. #3
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    Originally posted by spehar
    At first level and only first level you are granted the ability of certain racial skills. From second level onward you must choose your skills as you would as if race was not considered. I believe this is the second time it's been addressed so there seems to be some confusion and the definate need for more clarity.
    Mike Spehar
    Thanks for the response... you might have seen the question in my other thread on the races... in that thread I posted the following and in after thought I think it belongs hear more than there... so here it is for the sake of keeping things in one place:

    Originally posted by jaldaen
    Well... at first I was fine with the concept of treating those skills as class skills for 1st level only... but as Birthright-L (that nick sometimes confuses me, but I love it ;-) points out it "ignores" the class skill rules system. Though it would probably be more of a "confusing" of the class skill rules which could be clarified. I say this for the following reasons:

    Having the skills only count as class skills for 1st level brings up the question of what is the max skill rank of such skills when the character's chosen class does not have that skill as a class skill?

    The following are the options I can think of:

    a) Does the max skill ranks follow the normal rules for cross class skills thereafter, thus restricting the character from putting skill points into those skills until such time as they reach a level that allows them to put skill points into said skill. For Example: if I put 4 ranks into Knowledge (religion) as a Khinasi Fighter at first level due to the cross skill max ranks I would not be able to put another skill point into Knowledge (religion) until I was at least 6th level (when the max skill rank goes up to 4.5). This seems the worse answer as it is hardly a benefit at all b/c although you get that initial benefit it quickly fades to nothing.

    B) The max skill ranks is actually based on the normal rules for class skill thereafter, thus the character can spend two skill points per level to continue to advance in that particular skill at a normal rate. For Example: if I put 4 ranks into Knowledge (religion) as a Khinasi Fighter at first level I would at 2nd level (and every level therafter) have the option to spend up to two skill points on Knowledge (religion) and increase it according to the cross class rules (1 skill point for .5 in cross class skill). This seems a better possibility than option a, but has its own drawnbacks... and it could be said that at this point you might as well just make the skill a class skill and do away with the "unnessary" complication that this option entails.

    c) Make it a class skill period... this solves all questions and needs no further explaination.

    d) If you wish to keep the skills to cross class after 1st level, but not have the benefits "disappear" by 6th level then you might consider the following... not only say that they gain a skill as a class skill for 1st level only, but also say that their max ranks in that skill is at a +2 when it is a cross class skill. For Example: if I put 4 ranks into Knowledge (religion) as a Khinasi Fighter at first level I would at 2nd level (and every level therafter) have the option to spend up to one skill point on Knowledge (religion) to increase it by .5 with a max cross class skill rank of +2 to whatever the normal cross class skill max is (at 2nd level it is normally 2.5, so it would increase to 4.5). Note this would *not* affect the class skill max. This seems like a good compromise, but it adds a new layer of complexity that some my not like.
    With that said hope these ideas help,
    Joseph Miller

  4. #4
    Birthright Developer irdeggman's Avatar
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    Actually how cross class skills work is that once a skill is a class skill then it is always such for purposes of max ranks, but the cost of aquiring the new ranks is based upon the class in which the character gains the skill points. In your example a 1st level Khinasi fighter takes 4 ranks in knowledge (religion) as a class skill (cost 4 skill points), at 2nd level he can gain an additional rank (to a rank of 5) at a cost of 2 additional skill points and so on.

    So even if a skill is a class skill at first level only, it still follows the rules from the PHB in regards to cross class skills for multi class characters. I hope that helps.
    Duane Eggert

  5. #5
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    Originally posted by irdeggman
    Actually how cross class skills work is that once a skill is a class skill then it is always such for purposes of max ranks, but the cost of aquiring the new ranks is based upon the class in which the character gains the skill points. In your example a 1st level Khinasi fighter takes 4 ranks in knowledge (religion) as a class skill (cost 4 skill points), at 2nd level he can gain an additional rank (to a rank of 5) at a cost of 2 additional skill points and so on.

    So even if a skill is a class skill at first level only, it still follows the rules from the PHB in regards to cross class skills for multi class characters. I hope that helps.
    Now that you (and Mark ;-) have explained what was meant I understand what you are aiming at... I would just suggest that you might want to provide some clarification (in the cultural traits section) since the concept of having "1st level only class skills" is a new one and might be confusing as players and DMs might not know how to handle them given their unique nature to Birthright (I don't remember seeing anything like this in another publication).

    Thanks for the Response,
    Joseph Miller

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