Daily uses of Seeming

[Elrond]

How many times a creature with a Seeming score (http://www.birthright.net/brwiki/index.php/Seeming) can use the Seeming? Blood Spawn specifies nothing about it, I think. If the Seeming could be used at will, that would unbalance the game.

[Sorontar]

No real rules have been written for seeming. This has been an in-game hassle for me as I have wanted to work out to compete against it.

So for now, the rules are whatever the DM decides.

But I would really like to hear how people have handled seeming in their campaigns.

[kgauck]

Make it a skill. Use Will saves. Access to the skill happens at 3rd level for Priests of Ruornil, 4th level for Priests of Avani, and for others by a feat requiring an Wis 13, 10 ranks of Knowldge (Shadow World) and an experience in the Shadow World.

[irdeggman]

Nothing in the BRCS on it. I'm not certain where the linked information is from - but its not the BRCS so looking for the "author" might help some.

I would look towards some kind of tie with Knowledge (Shadow World) and Survival (in Shadow World).

And make it a skill.

IIRC all the score really does is help you to percieve differences in the Shadow World (not in the "real one"). So I'm not all that certain making it a skill check would unbalance things.

[kgauck]

I did a lot of it, and what I took came from Blood Spawn, the Shadow World pdf for Birthright. It is almost word for word from Blood Spawn, although I did remove sections which really belonged on pages elsewhere. This page is about the seeming, not the Lost or the Raven, &c.

I don't think I did much editing other than removing things that were not on topic. May have set up some links, or re-touched some passages, or added context linking this material to other pages that were already done. I ended up putting the whole description portion of Blood Spawn up, but none of the creatures.

[Sorontar]

Ken was the one who wrote the original Seeming page for the wiki.

But as I pointed out before, it might talk about seeing through seeming, but nothing is mentioned about what exactly are the seeming powers and whether there is a way to set up an anti-seeming shield, nor how to cancel seeming for everyone (ie. not just seeing through it as an individual).

Picture this. An evil halfling with seeming abilities is over the other side of the river with a hoard of minions. It is dark and he uses the shadow to make a thin bridge of shadow which his minions start walking over. How do you undo this, sending his minions to their death in the water? A light spell? Using your dispel magic spell? Simply not believing in it? Using your own seeming to undo it?

Spells can combat psionics so why isn't there anything to combat seeming?

Sorontar

[irdeggman]

I did a lot of it, and what I took came from Blood Spawn, the Shadow World pdf for Birthright. It is almost word for word from Blood Spawn, although I did remove sections which really belonged on pages elsewhere. This page is about the seeming, not the Lost or the Raven, &c.

I don't think I did much editing other than removing things that were not on topic. May have set up some links, or re-touched some passages, or added context linking this material to other pages that were already done. I ended up putting the whole description portion of Blood Spawn up, but none of the creatures.


Hmm . . . . someone added some 3.x stuff since they inserted "class skills" and ranks and a +2 synergy bonus, etc.

This probably led to the confusion since it mixes editions and still doesn't add any substantial detail.

[irdeggman]

Ken was the one who wrote the original Seeming page for the wiki.

But as I pointed out before, it might talk about seeing through seeming, but nothing is mentioned about what exactly are the seeming powers and whether there is a way to set up an anti-seeming shield, nor how to cancel seeming for everyone (ie. not just seeing through it as an individual).

Picture this. An evil halfling with seeming abilities is over the other side of the river with a hoard of minions. It is dark and he uses the shadow to make a thin bridge of shadow which his minions start walking over. How do you undo this, sending his minions to their death in the water? A light spell? Using your dispel magic spell? Simply not believing in it? Using your own seeming to undo it?

Spells can combat psionics so why isn't there anything to combat seeming?

Sorontar

Unless I'm mistaken the seeming was only for use in the Shadow World (and maybe for crossing back and forth) but not for manifesting things in the "real world".

[Sorontar]

The example I gave could be set in the SW, or it could be set on Aebrynis where the SW barriers are weak (or simply it is dark). It depends how the DM runs the campaign. Either way, I would like to know how people would try and undo the seeming (rather than just seeing through it)?

IMC (2nd ed), one of our party (an evil^H^H^H^Hhelpful halfling) has been allowed to manipulate shadow to widen an existing bridge by a few inches. From memory, he could walk on the shadows he had moved to the edge of the bridge. It wasn't much and it was done "in secret" but the DM allowed it. Two of the party have seeming abilities but they have been defined by the DM as set skills, e.g. hiding abilities, small scale reality manipulation, etc. As the Seeming score increased, the characters get new seeming skills but also become more and more likely to become a shadow creature (think bloodform for the SW). One character is already very grey and has to protect his eyes from normal daylight. Some people have confused him for the Duskman and there is a song going round saying nasty things about him (written by me, heard by my PC).

[kgauck]

Spells can combat psionics so why isn't there anything to combat seeming?

I just regard seeming as a magical effect. Evil halfling as a caster level, his power to form the bridge should be analogized to some exiting magical power, allowing assignment of a level, and counter it as described on the wiki at Casting_Spells#Counterspells.

In general, all seeming effects are either illusions or conjurations. In addition to dispel magic, which often works, spells that allow you to see things as they really are can be used to counter spell illusions, and evocations will often disrupt shadow conjurations.

I would use Knowledge (Shadow World) instead of Spellcraft to identify the effect you need to counterspell.

[kgauck]

Unless I'm mistaken the seeming was only for use in the Shadow World (and maybe for crossing back and forth) but not for manifesting things in the "real world".

I've been a big fan of using Seeming and the Shadow World in general as an explanation of many things magical. Starting with spells like Detect Undead and Hide From Undead, a lot of spells can be explained in terms of the Shadow World instead of just regular magical effects. Doing this means its much easier to see Seeming effects as magic we are already familiar with rather than a whole new mechanic.

Not only can we say that most of the Seeming seems to be illusion and conjuration, we can turn that around and say that most illusion and conjuration is the Seeming. Effects from teleportation, invisibility, and so on can all be described as Seeming.