Undead Legion

[Mantyluoto]

ok i was planning on using an undead legion War Card vs my Cleric Regent and knowing him like i do i know he'll want to try turning it. How is that covered in 3.5E? on a mass combat scale?

[irdeggman]

Individual actions are lost on the battlefield in the BRCS so turning undead as a class ability just doesn’t translate well. the PC can decide to join a unit as a hero unit, which adds a lot of bonuses to the unit in question. Don't use the stats from the BRCS for this though - Osprey proposed (and we voted on and approved) a different set of stats provided by a hero unit. I'll do a search of the site and find the results of that and post it.



The most effective, IMO, ways to handle undead units, other than via better/more units are via the use of battle and realm spells. Note that Undead Units receive no Morale save modifier (it is the trade off for never failing morale, except for when divine magic is involved) so their saves are basically only a d20 roll which means they are very likely to fail most magic saving throws.



The Cure Unit realm spell is particularly effective against Undead Units.


Cure Unit

Evocation

Level: Clr/Drd 4

Target: up to1 unit/3 levels

Duration: Instantaneous

Saving Throw: Unit (half)

Spell Resistance: Yes

Special Requirements: Temple (1), ability to turn undead.

You channel a massive amount of divine energy that you release in a single burst. For every three levels of the caster, one battle card unit may be targeted. All targets must in the same province and traveling as a single army or garrisoned in the same location. Normal units affected by this spell heal two hits. Undead units targeted by this spell take two hits. Undead units may make a unit saving throw against a DC 16 to take half-damage.

Unlike most realm spells, the final rituals need not be completed during the month in which this spell is cast. After the casting is complete, the spell's energies are available for the caster to tap during the final war move of the month in which it was cast, or in any of the four war moves of the following month. If, during this time, the spellcaster leaves the province in which the spell was cast, the spell is lost. The final rituals for this spell require that the caster be within visual range of the targeted units. The final rituals that complete the spell require approximately the same amount of time as casting a battle spell and may be completed upon the field of battle.

Regency Cost: 5 RP per unit affected.

Material Components: 1 GB worth of expendable ritual components.

[irdeggman]

Here's the link to the Hero Unit stats poll:


http://www.birthright.net/showthread.php?t=2708

[Mantyluoto]

idiot time sorry,

The extra attacks given by the Hero group, how do they work?

Is it a bonus to an existing attack roll for a second attack or is a number of new attacks. so a +2 bonus would be 2 extra attacks.

[Question]

In theory couldnt masses of archers just spam arrows at the undead hordes and move out of melee range constantly?

[irdeggman]

idiot time sorry,

The extra attacks given by the Hero group, how do they work?

Is it a bonus to an existing attack roll for a second attack or is a number of new attacks. so a +2 bonus would be 2 extra attacks.

Extra attacks are just like characters with a BAB of 6+ getting an extra attack, without the the modifier though.

So the unit gets an additional attack roll - when using a full attack action (i.e., they can't move to get there).

IIRC the threads had a lot of discussion on what this was supposed to be.

Try this thread.
http://www.birthright.net/showthread.php?t=2657

[irdeggman]

In theory couldnt masses of archers just spam arrows at the undead hordes and move out of melee range constantly?

Still a good tactic to use.

[Osprey]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Question
In theory couldnt masses of archers just spam arrows at the undead hordes and move out of melee range constantly?

Still a good tactic to use.

It's a great tactic, so long as you have plenty of room to maneuver, the enemy isn't using fast/cavalry units in addition to their undead infantry legions, and you're not defending some key strategic point (like a castle).


The most effective, IMO, ways to handle undead units, other than via better/more units are via the use of battle and realm spells. Note that Undead Units receive no Morale save modifier (it is the trade off for never failing morale, except for when divine magic is involved) so their saves are basically only a d20 roll which means they are very likely to fail most magic saving throws.

The Cure Unit realm spell is particularly effective against Undead Units.

Here is the place where divine battle magic would really shine: big undead-killing battle spells could very well transform a likely defeat into a decisive victory (those undead hordes are TOUGH!). Battle-versions of Mass Cure, Holy Smite (Good domain), Searing Light(?), and Disrupting Weapon would all be pretty effective against uundead leions.

Even without battle magic, some widened mass cure spells, or my favorite: Sunburst (Widened = 160' radius burst! - nicely covers one or more units) could deal some serious undead destruction (though Sunburst, a L8 spell, needs a L15 mage, druid, or clerics of Avani or Ruornil to cast it).

[irdeggman]

Even without battle magic, some widened mass cure spells, or my favorite: Sunburst (Widened = 160' radius burst! - nicely covers one or more units) could deal some serious undead destruction (though Sunburst, a L8 spell, needs a L15 mage, druid, or clerics of Avani or Ruornil to cast it).

Not gonna make it into the BRCS. That is individual level spells won't fit given the results of the polls.

The 10 min battle rounds basically eliminates their use from the group. Now that doesn't mean they can't be worked in when zooming in, that is handling individual combat in the middle of the battle itself. Just not a unit level thing.

A divine caster using battle magic is casting divine spells - so it will affect the morale of the undead units. Again they have no modifier to their check, so they can much more readily "fail" their check.