Action Dice

[Lee]

Has anyone experimented with the concept of Action Dice, as presented in
Eberron, and various other games? It seems interesting, and I`d like to try
it on my FtF group. Note: there is no regent-ing going on IMC, I would not
apply it to those actions.

Lee.

[DemyztikX]

Action Points
Fudge Points
Force Points
Hero Points

All really the same thing, and I've tried them all with my group. They never use them. They save them for something better, which never comes. The only time they started using points of things to change their abilities/odds/whatever is in Vampire: the Requim. They started using Wilpower and Blood to modify their abilities to keep up with the action. In another group were I am the player (D20 Future setting), I am the only one f 3 players that remembers to use action points, then again I have the weakest character but am the strongest player in terms of experience and rules.
I always try and use them because I figure they'll be helpful but my group always fails to use them. I would say try it, give them a certain number and if it goes well keep it up, if not, tell them that once they're gone they're gone or say, "hey, the AP aren't working, use them or lose them this session" or just drop them completely on the spot.

[RaspK_FOG]

It's an interesting concept: call it karma, call it the Force, call it Faith or Willpower, it doesn't really matter! it's a very well rounded idea.

As for hoarding them, well, this can be a problem.

[DemyztikX]

It's a concept that has been used enough times that it seems like a lot of game designers like it. It's good, adds more power to the players, the GM can easily control it with how strict he is with giving them out. Plus since the way the system is done, if you only give them a few it's easy to control how strong players become using them.
I like them because it lets players control the game more by being able to increase their odds of success. I have one player that rolls really low like 4 times in a row, freaks out gets pissed, then ignores it when he rolls 3 20s in a row. So being able to add a d6 or more to his dice would make him happy. Unfortunately everyone else just hordes them until they die.

Examples:
In FUDGE, Fudge Points can be used for anything and can basically be used to make rolls better or change a past event. More Fudge points are needed for bigger things. The GM can say no to any use.
In RealTime, players get Plot Twists, as does the GM. The pool is static, the GM can use them and then pays players how many he uses. If the players use them, they are payed to the GM for use by NPCs. They can retcon past information, give bonuses, make wounds less than what they seem, etc.
Force Points from Star Wars get better with the character using them and add a certain number of d6 to dependant on the characters level and wether he's light or dark side. I believe it caps out at 7d6 in this system.
In D20 Modern they're less flexable for Action Points ranging from 1d6 to 3d6 depending on level (however players get a LOT more than in other systems).
In DeadLands players get poker chips to represent their luck. Different colors represent the ability to go different things to change the out come.

[Lee]

In a message dated 12/4/05 4:48:18 AM Eastern Standard Time,
brnetboard@BIRTHRIGHT.NET writes:

<< RaspK_FOG wrote:
It`s an interesting concept: call it karma, call it the Force, call it Faith
or Willpower, it doesn`t really matter! it`s a very well rounded idea.

As for hoarding them, well, this can be a problem. >>

I was thinking about that. In a group I played with, we had them, but
rarely used them, I suspect because we forgot about them. I recently read
another game, where they suggested using poker chips or some other counter, and
physically passing them out as the events unfold. As the group gets familiar
with the concept, they should need little verbal reminding that they have them.

Lee.

[DemyztikX]

Yup, like in my examples, both Deadlands and Realtime recommend using poker chips. In RealTime it's really helpful since the points get passed around from player to player and to the gm and back. They make great reminders when you have a handful of 11.5g chips in front of you.

I think it's like $10-15 USD for a pack of 100 in 3-4 colors. I haven't gotten around to buying any yet, but I probably will.

[irdeggman]

Which is why I like what the Eberron setting did. You get a new set every level and any you didn't use before are gone. So there is little incentive to hang on to them for too long.

[ausrick]

In a campaign I am playing in, the DM uses what he calls "game points" which I believe how he uses them is kind of a house rule. We normally don't have too many left over because his campaign is a little harsh. We run into a lot of what I would call "Indiana Jones" traps where we have to solve some sort of puzzle to defeat them or proceed. We are allowed to spend points for hints. Also we can spend points to lessen the damage inflicted on a one for one ratio, which has thankfully prevented one player from having to roll up a new character every session, He's not the sharpest tool in the shed and manages to court death every game. (We've been playing for a year and no one else has actually died, but he is on his 9th character if that tells you anything, not counting all the times I've had to heal him when he's -9hp, For crying out loud the guy charged a group of barracaded goblins with flint and tinder to try to ignite some spilled oil, the goblins all had crossbows and the guy was wearing leather, can we say pincushion)

Enough of my rambling, I guess the point was for use in those traps and keeping us alive, we never seem to have too many to spare.

[DemyztikX]

Which is why I like what the Eberron setting did. You get a new set every level and any you didn't use before are gone. So there is little incentive to hang on to them for too long.

Thats actually a really interesting way to do it. I don't know if I like that, since that means if you don't have anything hard for a level and are expecting something horrible coming up, you can't save them for something good.
Example, Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, the party at one point is supposed to get a level by doing nothing but screwing around with some of the side track stuff. After a level gain they're supposed to fight a huge monster. They would then have to lose a whole level of points on pretty worthless stuff. Then again, I suppose it's all made assuming you have 0 points anyways, so I guess it would still be good.

[irdeggman]

Eberron also has built in many ways that feats can be used other than simply modifying success (e.g., attack rolls, skill checks, saving throws).



There a lot of feats that revolve around using APs.



Some add the AP result to the damage inflicted, others allow spending AP to spontaneous cast a metamagic spell (i.e., instead of memorizing it as a metamagic you spend a number of AP equal to the level adjustment of the metamagic effect), others allow things like gaining an extra move or standard action by spending AP.



So the system is designed to revolve around AP and not just having them around “just in case”.

[DemyztikX]

"So the system is designed to revolve around AP and not just having them around “just in case”.
That rather defeats the point of having them IMO. Especially with the system they use. Of course having not read anything myself, I can't say completely. This way it's just another game mechanic you have to be worried about running out of and not having enoguh. My players have enough problems keeping spells and hp in good numbers adding in more just means they have to worry about more. Then again, my players are below average skill IMO.

[irdeggman]

What I meant was that there are quite a lot of feats that use AP to accomplish things. And since feats are always chosen by the players they get to decide how valuable the APs are - its just that they have more possbilities to use them on in the setting.

[DemyztikX]

I'd have to play it to get a good feel for it, but it sounds a lot different from any other systems I've used with action points and such.

[Lee]

In a message dated 12/6/05 2:57:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
brnetboard@BIRTHRIGHT.NET writes:

<< DemyztikX wrote:
"So the system is designed to revolve around AP and not just having them
around “just in case�.
That rather defeats the point of having them IMO. Especially with the system
they use. Of course having not read anything myself, I can`t say completely.
This way it`s just another game mechanic you have to be worried about running
out of and not having enoguh. My players have enough problems keeping spells
and hp in good numbers adding in more just means they have to worry about more.
>>

That`s why I am leaning towards the AD-as-instant-rewards policy, instead
of just renewing the pool at each level.

Lee.