Alkaru Anwamane
04-21-2013, 11:41 PM
First of all, hi everyone, and I hope this is the right bit of the forum. I'm not directly using the community created 3.5 conversion for Birthright, but rather I want to discuss my own variant, since I believe there is content available that can better represent the setting, and I'm hoping some people can creatively disagree with some of my suggestions in order to make it better. There is a lot of great content on the wiki and forum, and I will definitely be borrowing some bits, with grateful thanks to the creative people who made them.
I'm primarily aiming to write up a full list of houserules in preparation for running a campaign, so while options are good in an official campaign writeup (whether WotC or your own write up here), I need to pick which options to use. I'm also not shy about changing stuff that is published canon to better fit with my vision of the setting.
I will try to number each distinct bit of the rules, both to break up the text, and to make it easier to discuss.
1. Birthright is a low magic setting. 9th level spells are fundamentally incompatible with this. I'm thinking of E8, so casters have access to 4th level spells but no higher. There may be a few individual spells that are problematic, but I like them getting access to Bestow Curse and Dismissal for example.
2. D&D 3.5 generally tones down racial impact on career options, especially compared to AD&D. I don't really like the way 3.5 or AD&D deal with race, but the rules do need to reflect differences between the races for it to be properly Birthright. I want to streamline the racial traits, to get rid of the minor legacy stuff like the pile of stuff elves and dwarves get, leaving the stuff people actually get as the relevant stuff, that is easier to remember during play, and makes meaningful statements about the differences between races. So all races get no stat modifications. The main impact of this is prevent anyone from having 20 or above at level 1. I always use point buy, and although the world in general is low power, I'm willing to give PCs and other Scions 32pointbuy. Elves are graceful and dwarves and tough, so they are more likely to have good dex and good con, but it's not mandated for PCs, although NPCs will in general conform to the stereotype. If you have a low con dwarf you might have been poisioned in the past or something as part of your concept. Humans get no free skill point or feat, their race has no impact on the character sheet at all(I think the standard human package is overpowered, but I could maybe be persuaded to let them keep the skills, the feat has got to go though). Hmm, for elves, checking their list of stuff, the only things I can really see to remove from their huge list, is the little bonuses, that +2 racial save against enchantments, and the +2 on the various perception checks(the low light vision is enough to represent keen elven eyes to me). I'd really prefer to shorten the list a bit, but the others all seem appropriate(especially the Infamous reputation, which is great for mechanical representation of flavour). For dwarves, I think the dodge, appraise and craft stuff can go, but the rest is fine. Halflings keep Shadow Sense and the bonus against fear, but the skill bonuses and slings can go. Favoured class is the big change in race. Each race should have a favoured class, and that class is the only one that can hit the level cap(or maybe a short list of favoured classes). Human favoured class should definitely be Cleric(and perhaps Crusader), the others are more debateable. Halfling as rogue makes a lot of sense, but that locks them from the top spell levels permanently, and given how magical they are I'm not really sure that makes sense. Rogue is fine for the PHB halflings, but I'm not sure how much it fits their Birthright counterparts. I was thinking Beguiler from PHB2, as the magical rogue might be a better fit. Elves and dwarves need a bigger discussion anyway, so their racial favoured classes will be in a later section.
3. Classes. I like using the full range of books, plus selected homebrew, but a few classes need special discussion. I like using Tome of Battle as it helps make melee more interesting(although some of the homebrew for archery disciplines needs to be added too). For Birthright, I think those techniques should originate with the Dwarves and Goblins, and have spread from there. The nature magic classes also present a problem in Birthright, because they are divine, and therefore closed to elves, who have strong nature fluff text. Cleric and paladin seem to me to the natural divine traditions of humanity in this setting. Druid and ranger could represent elven influence, but Erik is kind of in the way as he is needed for druids to get their spells according to the setting material, and I don't like divine magic available without gods as that doesn't seem appropriate for Birthright. I think druid should just be removed from the setting, and Erik has normal clerics with his published nature orientated domains. Rangers should just be replaced with scouts in general, and that leaves humans and elves with the same sort of skilled hunters, no divine magic involved. I kind of miss wildshape though, so maybe the spell-less wildshape ranger could be allowed. Wizard and sorcerer are Scion or elf only, and I'm tempted to make cleric Scion only, with Healer or something for the non-Scion priesthood. This restricts the powerful casters in the setting, and reinforces the power of blood and heritage, which seems thematically appropriate. It might weaken humans a bit too much though. Bard is another problem, it's arcane with limited healing, and fits well flavourwise with elves, aside from the healing. I think it should be available, including to elves, and represents a better time, when humans and elves worked together to make something beautiful and useful. This would logically make them awkward socially in the more isolationist realms.
4. Elves. Hanner Sidhe is definitely being used. I love that stuff. Much thanks to the people who developed this material. (oh and bards would popular with the people working on this project, which fits well with its social manipulation aspects). I want elves to be a valid PC race, but I also want them to lean more to magical beings than humans with pointy ears. I also don't want to give them too many advantages that mean they actually end up completely overwhleming humans. You can play a normal adventuring campaign in Birthright, but the domain stuff is the core of the setting, and that's what I'm going to running with this material, and as it stands elves are crippled in domain turns. Law, Temple, Guild, Source (and I've seen discussion about adding Trade routes to this, which I like). Only Source is available unrestricted, and although elves have an advantage there it really doesn't outweigh the problems the restrictions on the rest cause. Law is easy to fix, just redefine it a little and say high law can also represent a deeply respected and beloved ruler, who only has to ask for a thing to be done, and people are glad to assist, no restrictions on freedom necessary. It becomes a measure of Influence rather than purely the power of the legal courts.(a lot of humans in setting should be ruling that way too anyway). I don't like the very modern tree hugging hippy attitude of all guilds are horribly exploitative, it feels kind of out of place. Its true that elves really like their forests, and deforestation was a really big thing in the historic medieval period, but is it really impossible to have people making things for trade without exploitation of the land(and it's people)? It's true that it would be unusual for humans to act that way given the rest of the cultural premises, and a lot of guild types that are more common among humans would be impossible, but couldn't there be some elfy things they could do for trade(wine, jewellry etc)? Because of the limitations to only appropriately elfy stuff I can see a cap for guilds, maybe half the province level or something, and the more isolationist domains would have less, perhaps not even any at all. Temple, well they don't worship gods, but they surely have spirituality, and strong culturally supported traditions, like the Taelinri. Couldn't Temple be used to represent that? Along the lines of the bardic colleges sort of thing. This would also provide for a source of education etc. This would mean elves would need to use a different skill to gain the benefit, and they obviously would need an alternative to the divine spell access. Switching it to arcane would be easy, but being recognised socially as Taelinri(with the cut-off from other political power that that implies), could work as well. I think losing access to divine magic is already a huge huge disadvantage, and they don't need all this other stuff on top. I need to work out how I want to represent Taelinri, some sort of easy entry PRC would probably do, with the main requirements being social standing and skills. Another class that might be a good fit with elven culture is the Incarnate(the Chaotic Neutral version being the most common of course). A magical skill orientated class, it can fill in the holes created by the removal of AD&D's multiclassing, and if the right stuff is taken, can be used to aid with the effectiveness of bardic healing for damage, without gaining the other benefits of divine magic). It also gives the elves alternative to magical items that seem fitting for an immortal people. To enhance their magical nature I would borrow some stuff from the Ghostwalk setting, and have the elven spirits going into trees upon death. I'm even tempted to borrow an idea from the JRPG Tenra Bansho Zero, of the kugutsu, which are basically special trees carved into humanoid form, and then illusions used which create a sentient being fully capable of learning, and has to grow up naturally, and are also immortal. The elf version would lose the illusion bit, and this would simply be their method of reincarnation. This really makes them into nature spirits given form, but the need for them to grow up and experience the world and train normally gives them enough room to be relatable for players. TYhe only thing holding me back from this was I liked the Hanner Sidhe idea of humans becoming half-elfs, but if elves are magical beings to this extent, then how can the Hanner Sidhe really be called half-elves? I suppose it could be tied to their path of reincarnation, attuning them to one of the funeral trees, which manifests during their life as the visible signs of half-elvishness, and in death they follow the elven path of reincarnation, and can later be reborn as full elves..... This would make the human attack on the elves less of an atrocity, and more self-defence against cultural conquest.
5. Dwarves. The standard religion seems a little out of place here to me. I like them having religion, as a contrast to the elves, but Moradin just seems a little dull, in a setting that otherwise takes a fresh look at things. The lack of the other gods of the standard pantheon does make them a little different though I suppose. The fact they can live off rocks and dirt, seems to make them a more elemental race, despite their inability to use arcane magic, which usually represents ties to nature in Birthright. I like the dwarven smith archetype, and there is a prestige class in Magic of Incarnum called Ironsoul Forgemaster which would be perfect for them. It would need some more divine flavour text to fit the published material on dwarves. Their inability to gain benefits from Source holdings is a weakness, but at least they get all the other holding types, plus the full clerical magic options. I'll leave their lack of access to arcane magic alone, but I'm still not happy with the religion issue. What about changing them to ancestor worship, with an emphasis on the deification of important dwarves as well are some more general ancestor worship? There also needs to be a few more dwarven domains on the map. Yes humans are dominant now on Cerilia, but would a few more options for dwarf PCs regents not be nice? Favoured racial classes of cleric and warblade. Their martial tradition does not seem to be as strongly religious as crusader would imply. I found a nice homebrew for a martial artificier, which would also fit nicely for them, but I've lost the details at the moment, I think it was called the warcrafter.
6. Halflings. Desperatly need more than one domain. Given their strange and magical nature, it doesn't make sense for them to be acting so much like standard halflings and living so well integrated with humanity. Swordsage could work well as one of their favoured classes, given the shadow hand options, and it can work as an alternative way of representing rogue with special tricks that might look like magic to the uninitiated.
7. Bloodlines. I like the idea of using the Unearthed Arcana rules to represent this mechanicallyt, but at the time time it would mean losing a whole lot of the rather flavourful options from the AD&D material since you don't get as much stuff, and a lot of them are too strong to fit in that framework. Given PCs being Scions is kind of assumed in the game I would run though, it could perhaps be made to fit, with them just being a little stronger than those abilities would normally be, and PCs simply picking for the big list a few thematically appropriate abilities.
8. Psionics. I had at one point thought of using psionics as a way to to represent elven magic, and it basically doesn't have the human distinction between arcane and divine, and elves get the full options for magical healing. I also think psionics is just a better system in general, being more balanced than the broken core. However, I think that combined with the changes to the elven domain rules, it might make elves too strong, since theyt would be effectively equal to humans, aside from the population problem with the slow birth rate(or slow carving rate if I go with the trees option). Would probably need to have some sort of psionic bard if did this.
9. I had more, but it's getting pretty late here, and I've lost my train of though, so I'll take a break here for now, please comment!
I'm primarily aiming to write up a full list of houserules in preparation for running a campaign, so while options are good in an official campaign writeup (whether WotC or your own write up here), I need to pick which options to use. I'm also not shy about changing stuff that is published canon to better fit with my vision of the setting.
I will try to number each distinct bit of the rules, both to break up the text, and to make it easier to discuss.
1. Birthright is a low magic setting. 9th level spells are fundamentally incompatible with this. I'm thinking of E8, so casters have access to 4th level spells but no higher. There may be a few individual spells that are problematic, but I like them getting access to Bestow Curse and Dismissal for example.
2. D&D 3.5 generally tones down racial impact on career options, especially compared to AD&D. I don't really like the way 3.5 or AD&D deal with race, but the rules do need to reflect differences between the races for it to be properly Birthright. I want to streamline the racial traits, to get rid of the minor legacy stuff like the pile of stuff elves and dwarves get, leaving the stuff people actually get as the relevant stuff, that is easier to remember during play, and makes meaningful statements about the differences between races. So all races get no stat modifications. The main impact of this is prevent anyone from having 20 or above at level 1. I always use point buy, and although the world in general is low power, I'm willing to give PCs and other Scions 32pointbuy. Elves are graceful and dwarves and tough, so they are more likely to have good dex and good con, but it's not mandated for PCs, although NPCs will in general conform to the stereotype. If you have a low con dwarf you might have been poisioned in the past or something as part of your concept. Humans get no free skill point or feat, their race has no impact on the character sheet at all(I think the standard human package is overpowered, but I could maybe be persuaded to let them keep the skills, the feat has got to go though). Hmm, for elves, checking their list of stuff, the only things I can really see to remove from their huge list, is the little bonuses, that +2 racial save against enchantments, and the +2 on the various perception checks(the low light vision is enough to represent keen elven eyes to me). I'd really prefer to shorten the list a bit, but the others all seem appropriate(especially the Infamous reputation, which is great for mechanical representation of flavour). For dwarves, I think the dodge, appraise and craft stuff can go, but the rest is fine. Halflings keep Shadow Sense and the bonus against fear, but the skill bonuses and slings can go. Favoured class is the big change in race. Each race should have a favoured class, and that class is the only one that can hit the level cap(or maybe a short list of favoured classes). Human favoured class should definitely be Cleric(and perhaps Crusader), the others are more debateable. Halfling as rogue makes a lot of sense, but that locks them from the top spell levels permanently, and given how magical they are I'm not really sure that makes sense. Rogue is fine for the PHB halflings, but I'm not sure how much it fits their Birthright counterparts. I was thinking Beguiler from PHB2, as the magical rogue might be a better fit. Elves and dwarves need a bigger discussion anyway, so their racial favoured classes will be in a later section.
3. Classes. I like using the full range of books, plus selected homebrew, but a few classes need special discussion. I like using Tome of Battle as it helps make melee more interesting(although some of the homebrew for archery disciplines needs to be added too). For Birthright, I think those techniques should originate with the Dwarves and Goblins, and have spread from there. The nature magic classes also present a problem in Birthright, because they are divine, and therefore closed to elves, who have strong nature fluff text. Cleric and paladin seem to me to the natural divine traditions of humanity in this setting. Druid and ranger could represent elven influence, but Erik is kind of in the way as he is needed for druids to get their spells according to the setting material, and I don't like divine magic available without gods as that doesn't seem appropriate for Birthright. I think druid should just be removed from the setting, and Erik has normal clerics with his published nature orientated domains. Rangers should just be replaced with scouts in general, and that leaves humans and elves with the same sort of skilled hunters, no divine magic involved. I kind of miss wildshape though, so maybe the spell-less wildshape ranger could be allowed. Wizard and sorcerer are Scion or elf only, and I'm tempted to make cleric Scion only, with Healer or something for the non-Scion priesthood. This restricts the powerful casters in the setting, and reinforces the power of blood and heritage, which seems thematically appropriate. It might weaken humans a bit too much though. Bard is another problem, it's arcane with limited healing, and fits well flavourwise with elves, aside from the healing. I think it should be available, including to elves, and represents a better time, when humans and elves worked together to make something beautiful and useful. This would logically make them awkward socially in the more isolationist realms.
4. Elves. Hanner Sidhe is definitely being used. I love that stuff. Much thanks to the people who developed this material. (oh and bards would popular with the people working on this project, which fits well with its social manipulation aspects). I want elves to be a valid PC race, but I also want them to lean more to magical beings than humans with pointy ears. I also don't want to give them too many advantages that mean they actually end up completely overwhleming humans. You can play a normal adventuring campaign in Birthright, but the domain stuff is the core of the setting, and that's what I'm going to running with this material, and as it stands elves are crippled in domain turns. Law, Temple, Guild, Source (and I've seen discussion about adding Trade routes to this, which I like). Only Source is available unrestricted, and although elves have an advantage there it really doesn't outweigh the problems the restrictions on the rest cause. Law is easy to fix, just redefine it a little and say high law can also represent a deeply respected and beloved ruler, who only has to ask for a thing to be done, and people are glad to assist, no restrictions on freedom necessary. It becomes a measure of Influence rather than purely the power of the legal courts.(a lot of humans in setting should be ruling that way too anyway). I don't like the very modern tree hugging hippy attitude of all guilds are horribly exploitative, it feels kind of out of place. Its true that elves really like their forests, and deforestation was a really big thing in the historic medieval period, but is it really impossible to have people making things for trade without exploitation of the land(and it's people)? It's true that it would be unusual for humans to act that way given the rest of the cultural premises, and a lot of guild types that are more common among humans would be impossible, but couldn't there be some elfy things they could do for trade(wine, jewellry etc)? Because of the limitations to only appropriately elfy stuff I can see a cap for guilds, maybe half the province level or something, and the more isolationist domains would have less, perhaps not even any at all. Temple, well they don't worship gods, but they surely have spirituality, and strong culturally supported traditions, like the Taelinri. Couldn't Temple be used to represent that? Along the lines of the bardic colleges sort of thing. This would also provide for a source of education etc. This would mean elves would need to use a different skill to gain the benefit, and they obviously would need an alternative to the divine spell access. Switching it to arcane would be easy, but being recognised socially as Taelinri(with the cut-off from other political power that that implies), could work as well. I think losing access to divine magic is already a huge huge disadvantage, and they don't need all this other stuff on top. I need to work out how I want to represent Taelinri, some sort of easy entry PRC would probably do, with the main requirements being social standing and skills. Another class that might be a good fit with elven culture is the Incarnate(the Chaotic Neutral version being the most common of course). A magical skill orientated class, it can fill in the holes created by the removal of AD&D's multiclassing, and if the right stuff is taken, can be used to aid with the effectiveness of bardic healing for damage, without gaining the other benefits of divine magic). It also gives the elves alternative to magical items that seem fitting for an immortal people. To enhance their magical nature I would borrow some stuff from the Ghostwalk setting, and have the elven spirits going into trees upon death. I'm even tempted to borrow an idea from the JRPG Tenra Bansho Zero, of the kugutsu, which are basically special trees carved into humanoid form, and then illusions used which create a sentient being fully capable of learning, and has to grow up naturally, and are also immortal. The elf version would lose the illusion bit, and this would simply be their method of reincarnation. This really makes them into nature spirits given form, but the need for them to grow up and experience the world and train normally gives them enough room to be relatable for players. TYhe only thing holding me back from this was I liked the Hanner Sidhe idea of humans becoming half-elfs, but if elves are magical beings to this extent, then how can the Hanner Sidhe really be called half-elves? I suppose it could be tied to their path of reincarnation, attuning them to one of the funeral trees, which manifests during their life as the visible signs of half-elvishness, and in death they follow the elven path of reincarnation, and can later be reborn as full elves..... This would make the human attack on the elves less of an atrocity, and more self-defence against cultural conquest.
5. Dwarves. The standard religion seems a little out of place here to me. I like them having religion, as a contrast to the elves, but Moradin just seems a little dull, in a setting that otherwise takes a fresh look at things. The lack of the other gods of the standard pantheon does make them a little different though I suppose. The fact they can live off rocks and dirt, seems to make them a more elemental race, despite their inability to use arcane magic, which usually represents ties to nature in Birthright. I like the dwarven smith archetype, and there is a prestige class in Magic of Incarnum called Ironsoul Forgemaster which would be perfect for them. It would need some more divine flavour text to fit the published material on dwarves. Their inability to gain benefits from Source holdings is a weakness, but at least they get all the other holding types, plus the full clerical magic options. I'll leave their lack of access to arcane magic alone, but I'm still not happy with the religion issue. What about changing them to ancestor worship, with an emphasis on the deification of important dwarves as well are some more general ancestor worship? There also needs to be a few more dwarven domains on the map. Yes humans are dominant now on Cerilia, but would a few more options for dwarf PCs regents not be nice? Favoured racial classes of cleric and warblade. Their martial tradition does not seem to be as strongly religious as crusader would imply. I found a nice homebrew for a martial artificier, which would also fit nicely for them, but I've lost the details at the moment, I think it was called the warcrafter.
6. Halflings. Desperatly need more than one domain. Given their strange and magical nature, it doesn't make sense for them to be acting so much like standard halflings and living so well integrated with humanity. Swordsage could work well as one of their favoured classes, given the shadow hand options, and it can work as an alternative way of representing rogue with special tricks that might look like magic to the uninitiated.
7. Bloodlines. I like the idea of using the Unearthed Arcana rules to represent this mechanicallyt, but at the time time it would mean losing a whole lot of the rather flavourful options from the AD&D material since you don't get as much stuff, and a lot of them are too strong to fit in that framework. Given PCs being Scions is kind of assumed in the game I would run though, it could perhaps be made to fit, with them just being a little stronger than those abilities would normally be, and PCs simply picking for the big list a few thematically appropriate abilities.
8. Psionics. I had at one point thought of using psionics as a way to to represent elven magic, and it basically doesn't have the human distinction between arcane and divine, and elves get the full options for magical healing. I also think psionics is just a better system in general, being more balanced than the broken core. However, I think that combined with the changes to the elven domain rules, it might make elves too strong, since theyt would be effectively equal to humans, aside from the population problem with the slow birth rate(or slow carving rate if I go with the trees option). Would probably need to have some sort of psionic bard if did this.
9. I had more, but it's getting pretty late here, and I've lost my train of though, so I'll take a break here for now, please comment!