Magical Goblins

[Michael Goldsworthy]

Argh. I'm on a goblin kick again. :)

Humm... I strongly agree with the earlier view on this goblin - themed
thread that Goblin Mages/Priests of Cerilia _would_ use
ritualistic/cooperative magics, as compaired to the "accepted" use of magic
used generally by individual wizards/magicians/priests (as a rule). It fits
in very nicely with my views on goblinoid society/psychology (see my
previous post, yeah argue all you want, it's my views, not offical by any
means). Also, i'm going on a tangient here to be an arguementive sod, :)


>If I as a true Mage can design a +1 or a +5 longsword, which >will I make
(only argumentative sods need say a +1!).

Um, well, in theory I'd expect the creation of a +1 vs. a +5 weapon to be no
more or less difficult perhaps, but requireing fewer rare items? I mean as
a GM I'd probably require more exotic means to be involved in the creation
of a +5 weapon than a +1, if for no other reason than play balance... Mind
you I'd consider ANY new magic items "unique" regardless of the type (it's
not like you can just drop by the Magnus and ask him to loan you his
research library, no?)


>On a separate argument: Should it would be easier for a True >Mage who has
powerful realm sources to create powerful magical >items than a normal mage?

In a word - yes. that's NOT to say it can't be done, but to say that it
would be a longer process for a magician, and probably be less likely to be
very unusual (a swors +anything is likely to be made by either a Magician or
a Wizard; but a +2 Dragon Slayer is something I'd think only a Wizard would
be at least overcofindent to try to create such a thing...)

Now then, back to Goblins.
Magic items? I'd think that there would'nt be too many of them still on
Cerilia, and those that are are probably in goblin hands, at least in my
world. Why? Because I think that it's more likely two things have to be
taken into account, though maybe only one could apply in general:
1) that the items Goblins made were tempoary in nature, like potions,
scrolls, or wands/rods/staves. they'd be easier to produce, and I've never
viewed the Goblin peoples to be very good at viewing the possible future
need of something more permenant.
2) In my world, the goblin people are very "the strong rule" kind of
outlook. So why create something that a possible foe could use against you?
At least if it IS stolen, making it of limited usage (or small/unlikely to
be seen as a magic item - like for example a Robe of useful Items). This
also supports the "magic-user/priest" only idea - the majority of said magic
items probably were made for the creator in mind, not to empower some king,
but to grant *themselves* more power to *challenge* the leader and become
boss.
Of course, this still dosen't rule out more permenant stuff; and if you have
a high priest with a number of his acotlytes, magic armor and weapons are
not out of the question. They'd probably be just unique, and powerful.


Now; i'm going to share some rule - type stuff here - from my own game
world. If you hate the Player's Option rules, STOP READING NOW!

Here's my take on Goblin Priests of Azrai, using the Player's Option: Spells
and Magic rules set, modified with my views on the likely possibility
ritualistic nature of thier magic...

Goblin Priests of Azrai - 125 points
(10 Points) May Use Any Weapon
(15 points) Command Undead
(15 points) Resistance: Level-draining/Undead Attacks
(40 points) Major Spheres: Necromancy, Combat, Summoning,
Chaos, All
(20 points) Minor Spheres: Healing, Protection, Charm,
Divintation
(15 points) Mage School As Major Sphere: Shadow
(10 points) Increased Spell Duration (all spells - double
duration).
(15 points) Ability to percieve the Shadow Realm (as Halfling)
(-10 points) Delayed Casting Time (increasing the casting time
one step - segments equal melees, melees equal turns,
turns equal hours, hours equal days... Anything above
that merely has its casting time doubled, to represent the
ritualistic nature of thier spells).
(-5 points) No Armor over Chain and Shield

So, my take on the Globlin priests that worship Azrai in my game world. The
priests that worshipped thier old gods would be very diffrent, though the
casting delay would remain the same.

Anyway, if you've suffered though this post to this point I congratulate
you. Once I get going it can be hard to stop, so I'm stopping now.

'Bye
Michael Goldsworthy

-

[Soviet]

what's next? Are you also going to explain the Waaarrrggg!!?

Michael Goldsworthy wrote:

> Argh. I'm on a goblin kick again. :)
>
> Humm... I strongly agree with the earlier view on this goblin - themed
> thread that Goblin Mages/Priests of Cerilia _would_ use
> ritualistic/cooperative magics, as compaired to the "accepted" use of magic
> used generally by individual wizards/magicians/priests (as a rule). It fits
> in very nicely with my views on goblinoid society/psychology (see my
> previous post, yeah argue all you want, it's my views, not offical by any
> means). Also, i'm going on a tangient here to be an arguementive sod, :)
>
> >If I as a true Mage can design a +1 or a +5 longsword, which >will I make
> (only argumentative sods need say a +1!).
>
> Um, well, in theory I'd expect the creation of a +1 vs. a +5 weapon to be no
> more or less difficult perhaps, but requireing fewer rare items? I mean as
> a GM I'd probably require more exotic means to be involved in the creation
> of a +5 weapon than a +1, if for no other reason than play balance... Mind
> you I'd consider ANY new magic items "unique" regardless of the type (it's
> not like you can just drop by the Magnus and ask him to loan you his
> research library, no?)
>
> >On a separate argument: Should it would be easier for a True >Mage who has
> powerful realm sources to create powerful magical >items than a normal mage?
>
> In a word - yes. that's NOT to say it can't be done, but to say that it
> would be a longer process for a magician, and probably be less likely to be
> very unusual (a swors +anything is likely to be made by either a Magician or
> a Wizard; but a +2 Dragon Slayer is something I'd think only a Wizard would
> be at least overcofindent to try to create such a thing...)
>
> Now then, back to Goblins.
> Magic items? I'd think that there would'nt be too many of them still on
> Cerilia, and those that are are probably in goblin hands, at least in my
> world. Why? Because I think that it's more likely two things have to be
> taken into account, though maybe only one could apply in general:
> 1) that the items Goblins made were tempoary in nature, like potions,
> scrolls, or wands/rods/staves. they'd be easier to produce, and I've never
> viewed the Goblin peoples to be very good at viewing the possible future
> need of something more permenant.
> 2) In my world, the goblin people are very "the strong rule" kind of
> outlook. So why create something that a possible foe could use against you?
> At least if it IS stolen, making it of limited usage (or small/unlikely to
> be seen as a magic item - like for example a Robe of useful Items). This
> also supports the "magic-user/priest" only idea - the majority of said magic
> items probably were made for the creator in mind, not to empower some king,
> but to grant *themselves* more power to *challenge* the leader and become
> boss.
> Of course, this still dosen't rule out more permenant stuff; and if you have
> a high priest with a number of his acotlytes, magic armor and weapons are
> not out of the question. They'd probably be just unique, and powerful.
>
> Now; i'm going to share some rule - type stuff here - from my own game
> world. If you hate the Player's Option rules, STOP READING NOW!
>
> Here's my take on Goblin Priests of Azrai, using the Player's Option: Spells
> and Magic rules set, modified with my views on the likely possibility
> ritualistic nature of thier magic...
>
> Goblin Priests of Azrai - 125 points
> (10 Points) May Use Any Weapon
> (15 points) Command Undead
> (15 points) Resistance: Level-draining/Undead Attacks
> (40 points) Major Spheres: Necromancy, Combat, Summoning,
> Chaos, All
> (20 points) Minor Spheres: Healing, Protection, Charm,
> Divintation
> (15 points) Mage School As Major Sphere: Shadow
> (10 points) Increased Spell Duration (all spells - double
> duration).
> (15 points) Ability to percieve the Shadow Realm (as Halfling)
> (-10 points) Delayed Casting Time (increasing the casting time
> one step - segments equal melees, melees equal turns,
> turns equal hours, hours equal days... Anything above
> that merely has its casting time doubled, to represent the
> ritualistic nature of thier spells).
> (-5 points) No Armor over Chain and Shield
>
> So, my take on the Globlin priests that worship Azrai in my game world. The
> priests that worshipped thier old gods would be very diffrent, though the
> casting delay would remain the same.
>
> Anyway, if you've suffered though this post to this point I congratulate
> you. Once I get going it can be hard to stop, so I'm stopping now.
>
> 'Bye
> Michael Goldsworthy
>
>

[Mark A Vandermeulen]

On Mon, 16 Aug 1999, Michael Goldsworthy wrote:

> >On a separate argument: Should it would be easier for a True >Mage who has
> powerful realm sources to create powerful magical >items than a normal mage?
>
> In a word - yes. that's NOT to say it can't be done, but to say that it
> would be a longer process for a magician, and probably be less likely to be
> very unusual (a swors +anything is likely to be made by either a Magician or
> a Wizard; but a +2 Dragon Slayer is something I'd think only a Wizard would
> be at least overcofindent to try to create such a thing...)

I've thought about this as well. It would seem to me that owning a very
powerful magical manifestation like a Source Holding might be used for
making magical items. Perhaps if magical item creation is done in a source
holding, it doesn't require the CON cost to cast Permanency. Perhaps
special spells have been discovered, like a lower-level version of
_Enchant and Item_ and _Permanency_ and _Limited Permanency_ which only
work when cast in a Source Manifestation (and require the output of
mebheighl for that month). This makes particular sense for charged magical
items: once created, the wizard can give the item to a trusted lieutennant
to use, or to an ally. The wizard would probably fix the item so that only
he could recharge the item, thus increasing the reliance of the
ally/lieutennant on the wizard (and having the effect of making all such
items un-rechargable after the wizard's death). The big problem with this
idea, of course, is that it ups the magic-level on Cerilia, and so for the
time it's something I've considered but never done anything about. If a
PC asked to do it, I would probably let him research such spells, though.
Or perhaps it would be an interesting adventure to let the PC's hear
"through the grapevine" that so-and-so is making magical items and selling
them for a grand profit. He's surely too young to be making such things,
isn't he? Perhaps he's found some secret spell...

> Now then, back to Goblins.
> Magic items? I'd think that there would'nt be too many of them still on
> Cerilia, and those that are are probably in goblin hands, at least in my
> world. Why? Because I think that it's more likely two things have to be
> taken into account, though maybe only one could apply in general:
> 1) that the items Goblins made were tempoary in nature, like potions,
> scrolls, or wands/rods/staves. they'd be easier to produce, and I've never
> viewed the Goblin peoples to be very good at viewing the possible future
> need of something more permenant.

I very much agree here. I would think that permanent goblin magical items
would be very rare, but that there are/were a fair number of magial
one-shot items, particularly those which can be recharged and reused.
Perhaps things like magical runes were used: a piece of armour might be
etched with a magical rune, into which could be cast the power to make the
armour into armour +1 for 4 hours by trained magician-priests. The goblin
would go to the magician-priests, get the rune "blessed" (i.e. charged),
and then just before he runs into battle, he says the "prayer" that
activates the charge. Or a sword might have a Rune on it that holds an
Acid Arrow spell, which when charged, allows the goblin to cast the
spelling by speaking the trigger word and pointing the sword at the
target. In the middle of a battle, the goblin comes up against a
particularly strong opponent, he casts the spell from his sword, and then
closes with the opponent to press his advantage. If a magician-priest were
to be involved in battle, I would definitely expect her to be wielding
some form of wand or rod.

> 2) In my world, the goblin people are very "the strong rule" kind of
> outlook. So why create something that a possible foe could use against you?
> At least if it IS stolen, making it of limited usage (or small/unlikely to
> be seen as a magic item - like for example a Robe of useful Items). This
> also supports the "magic-user/priest" only idea - the majority of said magic
> items probably were made for the creator in mind, not to empower some king,
> but to grant *themselves* more power to *challenge* the leader and become
> boss.
> Of course, this still dosen't rule out more permenant stuff; and if you have
> a high priest with a number of his acotlytes, magic armor and weapons are
> not out of the question. They'd probably be just unique, and powerful.

True. If I were to include a goblin Permanent item, it would probably be
something that was almost instantly recognizable to any goblin--and that
he would give his eyeteeth to possess--and tell everyone he knew who had
it. Can you say "Goblin Crusade?"


Mark VanderMeulen
vander+@pitt.edu
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