Rules changes

[John]

> Yes I second that request. That is a big time consuming problem. We have
> ended up just letting our players choose powers because of the time
> involved. I would really like to make them roll for the powers though.
>
> Adam

I got fed up with it too, and I came up with a set of tables for each
derivation that keeps (pretty well) the same probability of getting
each power as the original tables. I've not done the same for
minor/major/great abilities, but it is quicker. I can post them to
the list if you like (and you'll have to give me a few days - it'll
take me that long to get my hands on them).

Hope it's some help.

John.

"Once I was a lamb, playing in a green field. Then
the wolves came. Now I am an eagle and I fly in a
different universe."
"And now you kill the lambs," whispered Dardalion.
"No, priest. No one pays for lambs."
- David Gemmel, Waylander

[John]

> Well, since as GM (or DM), I am involved in the creation of the PC's
> background. And I think that if the PC is going to be blooded, then he should
> be able to "buy" his bloodline with a starting number of "blood points" with a
> roll to see if it's going to be major or minor or lesser.
>
> Of course this is just my two gold ingots worth.
>
> _ Elton Robb
> "Your Generously Liberal GM."

That is a better system, I agree. The separate tables were a step
along the way so to speak, that kept things simpler before switching
to an advantage/disadvantage system during character gen, with
bloodling, both strength and abilities, being advantages of varying
value. It helps 'iron out' those really pretty useless blood
abilities that no-one wants by making them cheaper than the really
funky stuff.

John.

"Once I was a lamb, playing in a green field. Then
the wolves came. Now I am an eagle and I fly in a
different universe."
"And now you kill the lambs," whispered Dardalion.
"No, priest. No one pays for lambs."
- David Gemmel, Waylander

[Ed Stark]

Folks (again),

I know I'm opening a major can of worms here, but I'd also like to get
suggestions for any specific rules changes you've found you've had to make
to get BR to run properly in your games. These can be changes to domain
actions, character generation, or whatever. Please post to this subject.

PLEASE, PLEASE, keep these to a minimum and as brief as possible (including
references to the original rules, or specifying when these are home rules
you've had to inject). Keep in mind that these rules should not complicate
the game any further, but should make it more clear for everyone. I'll try
to review all suggestions and open any I intend to include up for debate
later on.

Again, thanks in advance.
-- ->-- ->-- ->--@
Ed Stark
Game Designer, Wizards of the Coast/TSR Division
Asst. Brand Manager, BIRTHRIGHT/GREYHAWK/MARVEL Group
TSR Website: http://www.tsrinc.com

[Justin Martin]

CLAIMS BY LAW HOLDINGS

This has been a major bugbear for us as it can be tedious and time consuming
and really adds nothing in the way of flavour to this rich setting.

We pay an amount dependant on the total number of holding levels. There may
be more appropriate methods but we have found this the easiest and most
expeditious.

Justin


- -----Original Message-----
From: Ed Stark
To: birthright@MPGN.COM
Date: Tuesday, 28 October 1997 8:08
Subject: [BIRTHRIGHT] - Rules changes


>Folks (again),
>
>I know I'm opening a major can of worms here, but I'd also like to get
>suggestions for any specific rules changes you've found you've had to make
>to get BR to run properly in your games. These can be changes to domain
>actions, character generation, or whatever. Please post to this subject.
>
>PLEASE, PLEASE, keep these to a minimum and as brief as possible (including
>references to the original rules, or specifying when these are home rules
>you've had to inject). Keep in mind that these rules should not complicate
>the game any further, but should make it more clear for everyone. I'll try
>to review all suggestions and open any I intend to include up for debate
>later on.
>
>Again, thanks in advance.
> -- ->-- ->-- ->--@
>Ed Stark
>Game Designer, Wizards of the Coast/TSR Division
>Asst. Brand Manager, BIRTHRIGHT/GREYHAWK/MARVEL Group
>TSR Website: http://www.tsrinc.com
>************************************************** *************************
>>'unsubscribe birthright' as the body of the message.
>

[David Sean Brown]

Ed,

not sure whether these constitute rule changes, but these are
interpretations of the rules we;ve used in our house game for the last
year or so:

1) You only need one guild to start a trade route

2) You may take an adventure action in the same round as a domain action
providing a) you can finish the action including travel within the time
remaining after your domain action (we decided some actions don't take a
whole month) nad b) you do not have to be directly involved in the domain
action (ie, leading your troops in war)

3) Guild and Vassalage RP are added to your total above and beyond the
maximum allowd by your bloodline

4) Bloodtheft on a scion of Azrai gives you a chance to acquire the taint
if the bloodline of Azrai is greater than your own (cance is 5% per point
difference)

These are a few I could think of off the top of my head. If any more come
to me I'l be sure to let everyone know :)

Sean

[Tripp Elliott]

Ed,

For Character Generation, rather than giving Regents a bonus 10HP, what
we generally do is give all character Maximum Hitpoints at First Level
wether they are blooded or not. 10Hp is just tooo many for some
classes(specifically Mages).

We also permit all of the Kits listed in the BR book, and depending on
where the game is located, the DM can permit others. For example, the
Blade character of mine I was describing a couple weeks ago.

When it comes to rolling Blood Abilities, I give players as much
latitude as possible. We roll their strength and such, but unless they
are dead set on a specific derivation, we don't choose it until we roll
for actual abilities. If an ability is rolled that the character wants,
he/she has their derivation choices narrowed down, if they don't weant
it, likewise, until all abilities are rolled, and maybe two derivations
are possible, then the character chooses. For example, had a player who
really wanted Animal affinity Great from Reynir[he wanted to act like a
werewolf], well we actually rolled him a great ability, and actually got
the Animal affinity. I would assume that if we had rolled say
Regeneration instead he would have accepted it with Anduiras or Reynir,
because if he didn't want Regen then Reynir wouldn't have been an option
anyways.

I caution my players against choosing Azrai as their derivations due to
the obvious complications that can come from it.

I tend to prefer for my players not to play evil character unless they
can do it real well. This was much influenced by the discussions on the
board. Evil is fine unless it's so blatant that the good characters
can't ignore it.

Ok, enough babbling from me for now, I'll think this over, these are
just my first thoughts on the matter.

Tripp

[Brian Stoner]

Ed,

I would like to see a revised set of tables for rolling up blood lines.
It has been a bit of a chore to keep re-rolling various abilities
because they did not match the derivation or strength of the bloodline.
Perhaps separate tables for each derivation with different lists for the
strengths (minor, major, great).

Brian

[abeard@zebra.net (Adam B]

Brian Stoner wrote:
>
> Ed,
>
> I would like to see a revised set of tables for rolling up blood lines.
> It has been a bit of a chore to keep re-rolling various abilities
> because they did not match the derivation or strength of the bloodline.
> Perhaps separate tables for each derivation with different lists for the
> strengths (minor, major, great).
>
> Brian
>
Yes I second that request. That is a big time consuming problem. We have
ended up just letting our players choose powers because of the time
involved. I would really like to make them roll for the powers though.

Adam

[KAI BESTE]

> Folks (again),
>
> I know I'm opening a major can of worms here, but I'd also like to get
> suggestions for any specific rules changes you've found you've had to make
> to get BR to run properly in your games. These can be changes to domain
> actions, character generation, or whatever. Please post to this subject.

1. Character generation: The bonus 10 HP are a bit much, especially
for mages.
2. Landed regents tend to be short on money in comparison to the
guilds. Perhaps a little change of the taxation rules would be nice.
3. Mustering armies. It's unrealistic if I just snap my fingers and
woops - there goes my elite infantry. Troups like that have to be
trained or hired as mercenaries. Knights could be an exeption, they
are not normal soldiers but vassals of the regent (at least in a
feudal setting such as Anuire).
4. Better charts to roll blood abilities. In the beginnig I tended to
pick them for my players, according to their description of the
character. When I tried to randomly roll on the table, it took about
five rolls for a *single* ability. I know most folks have since come
up with their own tables, as did I. But an official version would be
nice.
5. Rules for "conracting" Azrai's bloodline when you commit
bloodtheft on one of his scions.
6. I think that ruling domain levels up should get increasingly
difficult. The people have to come from somewhere, you can't just
order them to have more children :). I didn't find a solution yet,
but I discourage my players from excessive use of that action,
especially when they rule elven domains.

that's my 2GBs so far, thanx for reading

Kai

[Glenn Robb]

Well, since as GM (or DM), I am involved in the creation of the PC's
background. And I think that if the PC is going to be blooded, then he s=
hould
be able to "buy" his bloodline with a starting number of "blood points" w=
ith a
roll to see if it's going to be major or minor or lesser.

Of course this is just my two gold ingots worth.

=97 Elton Robb
"Your Generously Liberal GM."

John wrote:

> > Yes I second that request. That is a big time consuming problem. We h=
ave
> > ended up just letting our players choose powers because of the time
> > involved. I would really like to make them roll for the powers though.
> >
> > Adam
>
> I got fed up with it too, and I came up with a set of tables for each
> derivation that keeps (pretty well) the same probability of getting
> each power as the original tables. I've not done the same for
> minor/major/great abilities, but it is quicker. I can post them to
> the list if you like (and you'll have to give me a few days - it'll
> take me that long to get my hands on them).
>
> Hope it's some help.
>
> John.
>
> "Once I was a lamb, playing in a green field. Then
> the wolves came. Now I am an eagle and I fly in a
> different universe."
> "And now you kill the lambs," whispered Dardalion.
> "No, priest. No one pays for lambs."
> - David Gemmel, Waylander
> ************************************************** *********************=
****
> To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the =
line
>

[David Sean Brown]

As for the following suggestion, I believe it is already in effect. when
trying to rule up a province or holding, you add the attempted level to
the bas difficulty (10+) before applying any modifiers. So going from a
level 4 to a level 5 holding or province has a base successof 15+

Sean



> 6. I think that ruling domain levels up should get increasingly
> difficult. The people have to come from somewhere, you can't just
> order them to have more children :). I didn't find a solution yet,
> but I discourage my players from excessive use of that action,
> especially when they rule elven domains.
>
> that's my 2GBs so far, thanx for reading
>
> Kai
> ************************************************** *************************
> > 'unsubscribe birthright' as the body of the message.
>

[prtr02@scorpion.nspco.co]

On the bloodline chart.

I've developed such a chart. It's per derivation and the rarity of each
bloodtrait is taken into account. It really wasn't that hard- take a shot at it.

Randax

[hobbychest@pcsia.co]

BI>I caution my players against choosing Azrai as their derivations due to
BI>the obvious complications that can come from it.

BI>I tend to prefer for my players not to play evil character unless they
BI>can do it real well. This was much influenced by the discussions on the
BI>board. Evil is fine unless it's so blatant that the good characters
BI>can't ignore it.

I played a fallen Paladin that gained a tainted Azrai bloodline. He was
not evil. However he got a bad rep with anyone who knew about the
bloodline. I enjoyed playing a character living on the edge of good and
evil. He tried to overcome his bloodline by doing good. The impulses
caused by his tainted blood went against his alignment (resulting in
loss of paladinhood). My DM did a great job playing "the voice of
Azrai" as the character was drawn closer to evil. If played right,
Azrai blood can be useful, even in a heroic or good aligned campain. (I
eventually had a variation of a ceremony of investiture performed to get
rid of the bloodline. However, I never regained paladinhood.)

Robert Thomson

[Tripp Elliott]

David Sean Brown wrote:
>
> As for the following suggestion, I believe it is already in effect. when
> trying to rule up a province or holding, you add the attempted level to
> the bas difficulty (10+) before applying any modifiers. So going from a
> level 4 to a level 5 holding or province has a base successof 15+
>
> Sean

I like this suggestion, it makes a whole lot of sense actually.
Although, in reality, it won't make the rule action harder, just more
costly. Most Regents will throw more Regency at it to make it more
likely to succeed, but in any event, I like your method. Your method
gains more if one cannot use their present Province Level to modify the
result as well.

Tripp